So, what was the first product where D&D's soul was sold?

[DM_Jeff]

*yawn*

>>What I don't understand is this: if what WOTC is producing is not what players want, then why do the players keep buying it?

I don't know. They are making what I want so I am still buying. So are all the D&D players I know, all 22 of them.

D&D soul has not been sold. The day a book is written by computer, or where every sentence if crafted by a board of directors and finance, will be that day.

Last time I checked, every D&D book was written by a living person or persons, who likes D&D the game very much, and could probabally get paid more doing something else, but they are happy doing their jobs and wouldn't trade it for anything. So soul's still there in the stuff I read.

-DM Jeff

 

[Anti-Sean]

BTW, there's nothing more arrogant, in message boards or real life than to shroud a personal subjective opinion behind a blanket declaration that it is 'general agreement'.

You might want to slap an 'IMHO' on that blanket declaration of yours, lest you sound guilty of the crime yourself.

 

[Prince of Happiness]

Dungeon Delver goes for the punt...it's good! It's good! Dungeon Delver for the win!

Post at the end of page 1, pwns. That it's in old school font pwns even more.

 

[Raven Crowking]

OK, after reading the Warz thread, its clear there is a general agreement that at some point TSR and WOTC chose to favor marketing and commercialism over the "needs" of the players.

I would say, instead, that there was some point where people trying to make money realized that they needed to sell product in order to do so. Marketing and commercialism is involved in all forms of commerce, expecially once the numbers get higher than a few of your friends. You can't imagine that the cover of the Holmes Blue Box was chosen because TSR didn't think it would attract attention from potential consumers.

IMHO, the question shouldn't be, "When did commercialism creep in?" but rather "When and where do marketing decisions negatively impact sales and/or the game?" WotC needs to be concerned with both, because whatever hurts the game ultimately has the potential to also hurt sales.

Things like the OGL show that WotC was well aware of how many gamers view the game in a proprietary way, and is the smartest thing that I've seen since the game first appeared. OGL is the opposite of commercialism.

Other decisions, like firmly hooking minis into the combat rules, seem to be (to me, anyway) driven by sales.....and if we can identify these areas that are problematic (for some, anyway), the OGL offers that subset the ability to fix those problems.

I dislike the idea of denying that problems with 3.X exist, and I dislike the idea of lambasting earlier editions for problems that were related to the group rather than the game, but WotC should be given proper credit for allowing gamers -- to a far greater degree than TSR ever did (since the 1e DMG, anyhow) -- to stand up and say "This is our game" without getting a note from the lawyers.


RC

 

[Raven Crowking]

And then Diaglo probably bought D&D's soul on E-Bay a couple of years back.

Then it's probably in very good hands.

 

[Treebore]

I don't know about selling its soul, but I think it started to darken with taint back with the Avatar modules, books, etc... for switching to 2E. A great idea for explaining an "edition transition", but one so poorly executed I felt that it weakened the hobby.

I used to think its soul had been sold, but I have come to realize that is a very personal thing. My switching to C&C got rid of what was bothering me about D&D, and now I am able to look at 3E books and actually enjoy them more.

Now I see that 3E/WOTC didn't sell D&D's soul, it just changed things enough that it just simply isn't for me. Thats all there really is to it. It simply isn't for me. No souls were sold.

 

[Desdichado]

Now I see that 3E/WOTC didn't sell D&D's soul, it just changed things enough that it just simply isn't for me. Thats all there really is to it. It simply isn't for me. No souls were sold.

D&D's soul wasn't sold, because D&D is an inanimate thing and has no soul to begin with. But no souls were sold?

Let's not be too hasty there, Treebore. I have it on pretty good authority (Jack Chick) that the souls of many were sold through the evil machinations of D&D. It's like eBay for souls.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I'll say The Black Album.

I was going to say when Sammy Hagar got involved, but this works, too.

 

[Pants]

I was going to say when Sammy Hagar got involved, but this works, too.

My answer was gonna be Risk

 

[BlackMoria]

Holy Board Burp, Batman!!