Sorcerers and Sudden Metamagic Feats

[Gez]

OK, I just want to know if I missed anything.

Sudden metamagic feats are always worded like this:

SUDDEN SMURF [METAMAGIC]
Benefit: Once per day, you can apply the effect of the Smurf Spell feat to any spell you cast without incresing the level of the spell or specially preparing it ahead of time. You can still use Smurf Spell normally if you have it.​

Replace Smurf with something like Sudden, Still, Extend, or Empower...

So, these feats have no drawback for wizards (not the preparing-in-advance cost, nor the higher spell slot cost), but they still have the usual penalty for sorcerers, bards, and other spontaneous casters, right?

 

[Lasher Dragon]

I'm not sure I'm following you. What's the usual penalty for sorcerers, bards, and other spontaneous casters?

 

[JimAde]

I'm not sure I'm following you. What's the usual penalty for sorcerers, bards, and other spontaneous casters?

Longer casting time. And yes, as far as I know, that is the case. Sudden metamagic lets wizards steal yet more of the sorcerer's thunder.

 

[Lasher Dragon]

Huh. When I read the sudden metamagic feats, it was my opinion that these were mainly useful for a sorceror/innate caster type. Wizards have to pick their feats very carefully. As a wizard I would much rather have the option of memorizing any spell I am capable of in a metamagicked form than using a feat to get a once-per-day metamagic at no spell adjustment cost. Maybe I didn't think it through thoroughly, but it still seems to me the sudden metamagic feats were WOTC trying to throw a "frickin bone" to the spontaneous spellcasters.

 

[JimAde]

It seems to me that the spontaneous casters are more able to "waste" a higher-level slot on metamagic than a wizard. I guess it depends on your style.

But a wizard gets to use metamagic without increasing his casting time, at the cost of having to plan ahead. Now he can take a sudden metamagic feat and even that restriction is removed (only once per day, I know). Yes it takes a feat, but wizards get more feats than sorcerers.

A sorcerer does get the boost of not using a higher spell slot, but as I said I think they can afford that slot better to begin with.

 

[Lasher Dragon]

In the end I'd much rather just buy a rod than waste a feat on it anyway, sorceror or wizard. Of course, in some campaigns that might not be an option.

 

[glass]

Replace Smurf with something like Sudden, Still, Extend, or Empower...

Hyper...?

So, these feats have no drawback for wizards (not the preparing-in-advance cost, nor the higher spell slot cost), but they still have the usual penalty for sorcerers, bards, and other spontaneous casters, right?

I read it as not requireing an FRA for sorcerer, bard, etc, but I could be mistaken. Of course, the biggest penalty for wizards or sorcerers is wasting a feat slot on something which only gives a minor bonus once per day, which is why I didn't bother reading more carefully. It's almost as bad as Favoured of the Companions et al from BoED/BoVD.


glass.

 

[sullivan]

The "penalty" of Sudden Smurf feats is the per/day limit. Increased casting time is not mentioned anywhere in conjunction with Sudden Smurf feats. So yes that means Sudden Quicken is actually meaningful to spontaneous casters, unlike Quicken Spell. (or a "frickin' bone" if you'd like to call it that )

 

[Nail]

I read it as not requireing an FRA for sorcerer, bard, etc, but I could be mistaken.

Unfortunately.......

Sorcerers and Bards: .... But because the sorcerer or bard has not prepared the spell in a metamagic form in advance, he must apply the metamagic feat on the spot. Therefore, such a character must also take more time to cast a metamagic spell (one enhanced by a metamagic feat) than he does to cast a regular spell. If the spell’s normal casting time is 1 action, casting a metamagic version is a full-round action for a sorcerer or bard.

...you are mistaken. Eek.

Sudden Smurf feats are metamagic feats, nicht wahr?

 

[Nail]

So yes that means Sudden Quicken is actually meaningful to spontaneous casters, unlike Quicken Spell.

Sorry, but: Nope.