Star Trek Picard SPOILERS thread

[Dire Bare]

Cannot confirm directly, but some folks are saying that some scenes are off, and there is a question of cramming stuff in example--Picard's brain condition is terminal Like that should be put later in the season, instead we got it in Eps #2. It is the pacing, editing of scenes, nuances of the clothes to the period, scripts talk for characters not vetted properly. It is the small things that can bloom into bigger problems. For me, I just watching it for Picard only, guarded against the rest. And keeping it short....in description.

These aren't "mishaps", they are choices. You might not care for them, but they aren't mistakes.

YMMV, but I don't have a problem with the writing, the opposite really, I think the writing is fantastic so far!

 

[Truth Seeker]

I know that"s how the earlier story went. I was asking if anyone thought that they might retcon it - and what people thought of the idea. I mean, it's got it's inconsistencies (as most retcons do) but it's not impossible to retcon that Data and Lore are twins and B4 could have one too.

Judging from the license issued to Bad Robot/Secret Hideout...they have access to tinker from the Nemesis film and the Kelvin Timeline 2009 movie.
They have already retconned that DATA transfer to B4 was a 99.99% loss, and the Countdown comic showing DATA was a captain of a ship has been scrubbed.

The other former mentioned personas were before 2009, therefore that is no for now, unless the license to use them is rented.

 

[Dire Bare]

It's part of what Laris was saying when she described the Zhat Vash. "Have you never noticed the complete absence of artificial life in Romulan culture? We don't have androids or AIs, we don't study cybernetics."

Thanks, you're paying closer attention than I am!!

 

[Truth Seeker]

These aren't "mishaps", they are choices. You might not care for them, but they aren't mistakes.

YMMV, but I don't have a problem with the writing, the opposite really, I think the writing is fantastic so far!

Actually I do care...but there is evidence growing that the 'writers' are not well verse in Trek Lore.

As for the writing...our opinions differ there, let's us agree to disagree on the consideration to how the writing is just meh to the fanstatic, yes?

 

[Truth Seeker]

Soong's process did not require twins. Data and Lore look identical, but aren't really twins, in the sense they were created at different times. And of course B-4, an inferior model created before Data and Lore, also looks identical to his two younger "brothers". Maddox studied Data to develop his own android process, but it is different than Soong's. Why does Maddox's process create twins? Perhaps we'll learn more . . .

That is creative writing, a mystery box from Bad Robot/Secret Hideout.

 

[Dire Bare]

Actually I do care...but there is evidence growing that the 'writers' are not well verse in Trek Lore.

As for the writing...our opinions differ there, let's us agree to disagree on the consideration to how the writing is just meh to the fanstatic, yes?

Sorry, not what I meant. I did not mean to say that you do not care about the show or the writing, but that you don't seem to care for the writing . . . in other words, you do not like it. And yes, we disagree, that's OK of course . . .

I'd love to see your "evidence" that the writers for "Picard" are not well-versed in Trek lore. If we stick to the TV shows and movies only (ignore the comics, novels, etc), we have a sprawling shared universe that is over 50 years old . . . . inconsistencies and minor ret-cons are inevitable, and have long been a part of Trek. The new show doesn't perfectly match up with everything that has come before, sure . . . but no Trek show or movie ever has.

 

[Truth Seeker]

Sorry, not what I meant. I did not mean to say that you do not care about the show or the writing, but that you don't seem to care for the writing . . . in other words, you do not like it. And yes, we disagree, that's OK of course . . .

I'd love to see your "evidence" that the writers for "Picard" are not well-versed in Trek lore. If we stick to the TV shows and movies only (ignore the comics, novels, etc), we have a sprawling shared universe that is over 50 years old . . . . inconsistencies and minor ret-cons are inevitable, and have long been a part of Trek. The new show doesn't perfectly match up with everything that has come before, sure . . . but no Trek show or movie ever has.

On that we agree,

As for the evidence, it may not be in print that I know of, but there are other 'experts' who knows the Lore like wearing their favorite shirts, have been pointing out the issues. Me, I would like very much for the show to succeed, but if the flaws are not addressed, it will become very apparent on how this show is present.

And in truth, there is no excuse at all for this....there is over 50 years of history there. If there is nit and pick attitude, that will not end well. You can respect the canon, use it for guidelines while you make your new path, journeys and new stories or slightly rehashed ones But to ignore it in total, invites disaster.

And the evidence for that, is already showing up in other beloved franchises of great age.

Star Wars and Doctor Who.

Peace

 

[MarkB]

On that we agree,

As for the evidence, it may not be in print that I know of, but there are other 'experts' who knows the Lore like wearing their favorite shirts, have been pointing out the issues. Me, I would like very much for the show to succeed, but if the flaws are not addressed, it will become very apparent on how this show is present.

And in truth, there is no excuse at all for this....there is over 50 years of history there. If there is nit and pick attitude, that will not end well. You can respect the canon, use it for guidelines while you make your new path, journeys and new stories or slightly rehashed ones But to ignore it in total, invites disaster.

And the evidence for that, is already showing up in other beloved franchises of great age.

Star Wars and Doctor Who.

Peace

What gives you the impression that they're ignoring it in total? So far they seem to have been building upon both major and minor elements from both the movies and TV series.

 

[shawnhcorey]

Soong's process did not require twins. Data and Lore look identical, but aren't really twins, in the sense they were created at different times. And of course B-4, an inferior model created before Data and Lore, also looks identical to his two younger "brothers".

Soong made B4, Lore, and Data in his own image. Not surprising they all look like him.

 

[Truth Seeker]

What gives you the impression that they're ignoring it in total? So far they seem to have been building upon both major and minor elements from both the movies and TV series.

Okay, let's start with this...who is the show catering to?

Is for kids? No...

Is for the long time fans trekkers Maybe...

Is for the casual viewer that don't know the full Lore of Trek? Yes.

They can emulate the feels of Trek, bring up fond memories for those who carry the franchise in their hearts for years upon years. Bu there has been a visual push to forego the nuances of this long legacy, that is very apparent. As I said before, I would like to see the show to be successful. But the one factor that help the show to be greater accepted.

You have to involve the Next Generation pun not intended, the young folks, the kids, and that is not there.

Behind a paywall, dropping curse words, if not seeking to have the show remembered for years to come, not having that great impression that would last in the minds of the many. What would be great about the show after its run, what would stand out and be talked about in the forums, person to person, etc., etc.

To pull a line that shows that there is a minority that does not care for long legacies and seek to tear them down, "Let the Past die, kill it if you have to" is a warning to the legacy bearers, that nothing is sacred anymore. I understand that franchises need to be 'refreshed' for today's current audiences, but the memory of those said franchises, are passed down by those who witness its beginnings, interact with it journey with purchases in the merchandising.

Right now, there is one or two vendor working with the show, the rest want nothing to do with it. They already have stated that the show premise is not recognizable to gain attention to sell stuff, to them. Without this extended avenue to gain traction, interest will wane.

Yes, I do look at this, with market value eyes on witnessing to how sustaining the longevity of this show will pan out. If the market is not biting. How will this show survive?

Ratings alone can't sustain it, it has to be massive multi level in merchandising, so the other effort is to sell to markets like to Amazon or NetFlick or in Canada for viewership. But will that be enough?

Rumor is that for 10 eps, price tag runs at $400 million dollars in total, originally suppose to be 13 eps, but condense down to 10. And for the emotional aspect of this, I am glad it is back, the Trek journey...but it should be reaching out to the younger crowd, the kids.

Right now...it is not doing that.

The past is the connective tissue for the present and the future going forward.

Kill it...

We become lost, without direction.

Take care.