The D&D 4th edition Rennaissaince: A look into the history of the edition, its flaws and its merits

[Thomas Shey]

The multiclass system in 4E is something that I think there can be some legitimate discussion on. I didn't see it used very often and I don't think it was really updated (outside of Gestalt characters). I think the "archetypes" from PF2 are a good development from that initial idea.

I used it for the one character I played in 4e (a cleric with multiclass investment in wizard), but I will agree it was pretty underwhelming overall, and if you wanted to go that route, PF2e's approach seems much superior (if sometimes overly punitive if Free Archetype isn't in use).

 

[Thomas Shey]

To which I’d respond that “single-classing” like that- while I did occasionally do it in D&D- is not a unique D&D experience. I could play that kind of PC in virtually any RPG.

Well, I have to point out that you also can do what D&D has called multiclassing in most just by you choice of character build options in most of them. But I know you know that since you're also an old Hero guy.

 

[Joshua Randall]

For the record, in my experience at a variety of LFR epic tier tables [sightation needed = me], exactly one 4e multiclass feat to cherry-pick just the right swap for unlimited powaaaaah -- was reasonably common. So that means a bunch of us were technically playing multiclassed characters in 4e, and as we all know, the BEST kind of correct is TECHNICALLY correct.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

But I know you know that since you're also an old Hero guy.

A very old HERO guy.

 

[Staffan]

And a game that expects that behavior should IMO be very explicit about it, so prospective players don't feel like they're getting a bait and switch.

Martial: Martial powers are not magic in the traditional sense, although some martial powers stand well beyond the capabilities of ordinary mortals. Martial characters use their own strength and willpower to vanquish their enemies. Training and dedication replace arcane formulas and prayers to grant fighters, rangers, rogues, and warlords, among others, their power. Martial powers are called exploits.

So while it doesn't quite mention anime territory, the 4e PHB is quite clear that martial heroes can perform deeds just as unrealistic as a wizard evoking fire from nothing.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Led Zepplin was a blues band.

Heavy blues/blues rock, but yes.

 

[Thomas Shey]

A very old HERO guy.

Just remember who you're talking to.

 

[Mannahnin]

For the record, in my experience at a variety of LFR epic tier tables [sightation needed = me], exactly one 4e multiclass feat to cherry-pick just the right swap for unlimited powaaaaah -- was reasonably common. So that means a bunch of us were technically playing multiclassed characters in 4e, and as we all know, the BEST kind of correct is TECHNICALLY correct.

Yes, a single-feat dip for, say, a once daily Healing Word was pretty darn common and useful.

The power-swap feats usually not so much, sadly, because you had to spend a feat for a trade.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Just remember who you're talking to.

Ehhhh, what’s that sonny? SPEAK UP!

I’m probably old enough that I could stat you out as a 5Ed critter called a “whippersnapper”.

…if I can find my glasses.

 

[Joshua Randall]

Sorry, yes, I did mean the MC entry feat not the true "power swap" feat. That is what was widespread in my circles.

Although me personally? I did end up taking the entry feat and a power swap feat on a few characters. For example I remember my level 30 paladin had some warlord power than he really wanted, and it was worth two feats to me. And some other character used two feats to get the wizard power Mass Charm, which doesn't have an attack roll, and can be... liberally interpreted... to let you move allies around with it and "force" them to make attacks.