D&D General The Monsters Know What They're Doing ... Are Unsure on 5e24

[TwoSix]

How do you tell the difference between the two?

"With only access to published information and/or a 1-2 sentence summary of the pitch, can a player come up with a concept and determine correctly if it would be invalid for the setting?" would be the closest thing I can think of to a litmus test.

 

[tetrasodium]

If the GM does feel that way, I'd be happy to hear them state their case and defend it, as I have here.

I'm fully comfortable that in the context of this thread, I am making a normative case, not attempting to do an objective characterization.

I just did by asking the difference ans pointing that out. The onus is on you to explain how it is not the case or explain the difference better. I'm not even the only poster to point out that the original pair of "subtly different" phrases seem indistinguishable.

 

[TwoSix]

DM walks away you have no DM or another player has to do it.

If the table had a vote, that the GM agreed to, and then the GM walked away when they lost....yea, probably for the best.

 

[TwoSix]

I just did by asking the difference ans pointing that out. The onus is on you to explain how it is not the case or explain the difference better. I'm not even the only poster to point out that the original pair of "subtly different" phrases seem indistinguishable.

I already explained that in the post you quoted. If the difference is still confusing, I lack the desire to provide more clarity then I already have.

 

[Remathilis]

Eberron is not a kitchen sink campaign unless you change it just to name a current setting and last time I checked it's quite popular. FR is a kitchen sink because WOTC wants to sell more splat books and new species.

Sigh. Let me get the quotes...

If it Exists in D&D, It exists in Eberron
1. If it exists in D&D, then it has a place in Eberron. A monster or spell or magic item from
the core rulebooks might feature a twist or two to account for Eberron’s tone and attitude,
but otherwise everything in the Player’s Handbook, Dungeon Master’s Guide, and Monster Manual has a place somewhere in Eberron. Also, this is the first D&D setting built entirely from the v.3.5 rules, which enabled us to blend rules and story in brand-new ways.
(Eberron Campaign Setting, pg 8)

1. If it exists in the D&D world, then it has a place in Eberron. Eberron is all about using the core elements of the D&D world in new ways and interesting combinations, with some unique elements thrown in. It's still a D&D setting, so any information for players that appears in another D&D core rulebook or supplement—from the classes and races in a Player's Handbook to the new powers and other features in a book such as Divine Power—should fit right in to your Dungeon Master's EBERRON campaign. (Of course, your DM always has the final word about what parts of the D&D game are allowed and not allowed in
the campaign.)
(Eberron Player’s Guide, pg 4)

7. D&D with a Twist. Every race, monster, spell, and magic item in the Player's Handbook,
Dungeon Master's Guide, and Monster Manual has a place somewhere in Eberron, but it
might not be the place you expect. Eberron has a unique spot in the D&D multiverse, and
many familiar elements of the game play different roles in the world. In particular, mortal
creatures are products of culture and circumstances, rather than the direct influence of the gods. As a result, you can't assume that a gold dragon is good or a beholder is evil; only in the case of celestials, fiends, and certain other creatures whose identity and worldview are shaped by magic (such as the curse of lycanthropy) is alignment a given.
(Eberron: Rising From the Last War, pg 5

Where people get that Eberron isn't a kitchen sink with a twist is beyond me.

 

[AlViking]

Sigh. Let me get the quotes...

If it Exists in D&D, It exists in Eberron
1. If it exists in D&D, then it has a place in Eberron. A monster or spell or magic item from
the core rulebooks might feature a twist or two to account for Eberron’s tone and attitude,
but otherwise everything in the Player’s Handbook, Dungeon Master’s Guide, and Monster Manual has a place somewhere in Eberron. Also, this is the first D&D setting built entirely from the v.3.5 rules, which enabled us to blend rules and story in brand-new ways.
(Eberron Campaign Setting, pg 8)

1. If it exists in the D&D world, then it has a place in Eberron. Eberron is all about using the core elements of the D&D world in new ways and interesting combinations, with some unique elements thrown in. It's still a D&D setting, so any information for players that appears in another D&D core rulebook or supplement—from the classes and races in a Player's Handbook to the new powers and other features in a book such as Divine Power—should fit right in to your Dungeon Master's EBERRON campaign. (Of course, your DM always has the final word about what parts of the D&D game are allowed and not allowed in
the campaign.)
(Eberron Player’s Guide, pg 4)

7. D&D with a Twist. Every race, monster, spell, and magic item in the Player's Handbook,
Dungeon Master's Guide, and Monster Manual has a place somewhere in Eberron, but it
might not be the place you expect. Eberron has a unique spot in the D&D multiverse, and
many familiar elements of the game play different roles in the world. In particular, mortal
creatures are products of culture and circumstances, rather than the direct influence of the gods. As a result, you can't assume that a gold dragon is good or a beholder is evil; only in the case of celestials, fiends, and certain other creatures whose identity and worldview are shaped by magic (such as the curse of lycanthropy) is alignment a given.
(Eberron: Rising From the Last War, pg 5

Where people get that Eberron isn't a kitchen sink with a twist is beyond me.

You can include every species under the sun along with gods and anything else you want. It just makes it less Eberron and more generic D&D world. Of course the books are going to include caveats like the ones you quoted because it's a WOTC book and WOTC wants to sell more splat books.

Just because you can do something that doesn't mean you should or that most people (including everyone I ever played Eberron game with) would want to.

 

[Bae'zel]

My only past gripe with Eberron is a DM not using ANY of the cool “magitech” stuff at all. That was mismatched expectations. I don’t think we met a single warforged.

 

[Dire Bare]

That doesn't seem that specific to me, gotta be honest.

I know a ton of people who see a good portion of their friends primarily in the context of a shared hobby or activity. If they stopped the activity, they would see their friends much less.

If I decided to give up roleplaying, I of course would see my game table friends less. That's not them excluding me, that's me choosing to exclude myself.

Yup.

IME, it's more common to have friends through a shared activity or hobby, especially once you get past school (K12 or college). Obviously, some folks have long term neighborhood friends from childhood, or have made friends in other contexts, but yeah.

I used to be heavily into community theatre and had a very large social circle and group of friends. For reasons, I'm not doing theatre anymore, and so rarely see all of my theatre friends! We're all still friends, but some of these folks I haven't seen in years. If I took up theatre again, we'd all slide right back into our old friendships. D&D is no different for many of us.

 

[Zardnaar]

If the table had a vote, that the GM agreed to, and then the GM walked away when they lost....yea, probably for the best.

Main point is you can't force DM to agree to a vote. Even then DM could still say here's my hard limits. No evil games no ifs or buts. Players voting doesnt matter.

I gave my players a choice and they picked Norse. I walked ed away from that game not because I lost but I wasn't enjoying it. Got to level 7 no one was wrong. I thought I could do Norse turns out I was wrong.

A DM can voluntarily agree to players voting. I do it more informally and bail down the break points over a week or two. Build the sandbox after that.

Of youre playing with randoms/newbies you build a smaller sandbox at least initially. I'll also do a session 0 and basically cover what youre doing generally KISS principle. Starter set 1-3.

Booting players is extreme 4 tines 12 years technically 3 times one quit right before being booted). Mostly you just dont invite them back for next game if theyre a poor fit.

Theres to many variables imho.

 

[Remathilis]

You can include every species under the sun along with gods and anything else you want. It just makes it less Eberron and more generic D&D world. Of course the books are going to include caveats like the ones you quoted because it's a WOTC book and WOTC wants to sell more splat books.

Just because you can do something that doesn't mean you should or that most people (including everyone I ever played Eberron game with) would want to.

That's fine, Eberron specifically says the DM can change it. But that doesn't stop making Eberron a kitchen sink by default. There are a half-dozen settings that D&D makes that aren't kitchen sinks. Eberron isn't one of them. Sorry to burst your bubble.