D&D General The Role and Purpose of Evil Gods

[Maxperson]

Definitely more reasonable in general, but still not necessarily reasonable for being applied even to minor villages in the middle of nowhere.

Except for very rare exceptions, small villages probably won't even have locks that are that good. You don't need much more for the town drunk or some locals who got into a fight.

 

[Maxperson]

Also. How much does 200 gold and incense actually costs? This is the price the players are expected to pay. But how much will the kingdom actually pay for these? 100 gold?

If modern governments are any indication, about 1759 gold.

 

[Zubatcarteira]

In my game PCs need tools to open locks. Period. Whether their well made or improvised, they need something more than their fingers or tongue to open a lock.

Well, if the sheriff isn't doing a very thorough inspection, it's always possible to slip some tools in, they're not that big.

 

[Maxperson]

Well, if the sheriff isn't doing a very thorough inspection, it's always possible to slip some tools in, they're not that big.

Sure. That's possible.

 

[Helldritch]

Well, if the sheriff isn't doing a very thorough inspection, it's always possible to slip some tools in, they're not that big.

Of course anything is possible. But what if the corrupted sheriff is half decent at his job?
They might not be that big, but they're still hard to conceal. It is not a tiny key for a small padlock as modern illusionnist are using. Keys were big because locks were not easy to turn even when oiled properly. I've had the chance to hold keys for a cell made for the Quebec's citadel and to try to turn the key. I'm not a small man at 6'1", 225 lbs and it was not that easy. Tiny lock picks would not do much to open a cell. Modern locks taints how we view locks from an other time.

 

[Zubatcarteira]

Of course anything is possible. But what if the corrupted sheriff is half decent at his job?
They might not be that big, but they're still hard to conceal. It is not a tiny key for a small padlock as modern illusionnist are using. Keys were big because locks were not easy to turn even when oiled properly. I've had the chance to hold keys for a cell made for the Quebec's citadel and to try to turn the key. I'm not a small man at 6'1", 225 lbs and it was not that easy. Tiny lock picks would not do much to open a cell. Modern locks taints how we view locks from an other time.

There's always a place if you're determined enough.

 

[Faolyn]

Of course anything is possible. But what if the corrupted sheriff is half decent at his job?

What if it doesn't matter because it's a backstory? It's a one-off event in the character's life that occurred before the game started. They got lucky that time. If they hadn't gotten lucky, they would still be in jail and not in the game. You can ensure they never get that lucky again, if you like.

 

[Chaosmancer]

These costs are for PCs.

No, these are the costs. There isn't a seperate listing for NPC costs. If you want to play the "I just make up numbers game" we can play it. But it will render all conversation useless.

No I am not. That is your claim

No, my claim is that you started just making things up to justify calling something impossible. And considering that to defend it you want to just make up numbers...

Thermal shock is caused by extreme heat followed by extreme cold. That is not what the spell is doing.

Then use your logic. For thermal shock to happen, you need extreme heat followed by extreme cold.

No, you need a massive difference in heat and cold. "Extreme" heat and cold is relative, since there are materials that boil at room temperature.

You keep adding castings cost where I did say that these prices are for the players. It is after all, what the players can expect to pay. Not what the local lord will...

The base cost is the same. The actual casting is always free.

No, these are the prices, because guess what? The PC might end up BEING the local lord. I know it is impossible in your world, but the game does provide the "noble" background and nothing at all is written forbidding PCs from being the local lord. So, there is no reason to assume that the prices are going to change.

Additionally, the casting was not declared free. You declared it was them paying their taxes. This means it has a monetary value. And there are official equations for how much casting a spell costs, and you will note if you go back and reference it, the larger part of the cost isn't coming from the components. Now, if you want to change it, AGAIN, so that the caster is forced to work for a month or so traveling from small village to small village providing thousands of gold of labor for "free" with no regard to what they actually owe in taxes... Well, it just goes to show that you really will stop at nothing to enforce your will despite any opposition.

Not really. Pick pockets and drunk will not try to escape as their lives will not be endangered. Spies and criminals on the other hand...
So this is perfectly valid.

Well, that's dead wrong. We are using medieval logic remember? Pickpockets were sentenced to hang. The character who I proposed was never even accused of a crime in this thread, and you had him being executed next day.

Also, just read your own frickin post. Pick pockets won't try to escape, but criminals will? Are you just not aware that stealing is a crime? And maybe the drunk DOES try to escape.

Yep. Not every villages will have a Jail. A jail is a big thing you know?

But if they do have a jail (like you forced the character I proposed into) it will be magically enchanted and capable of holding any sized creature.

The maximum security prison of a fantasy world is temporal stasis. Especially with high magic as in 5ed.

Funny how I see a lack of evidence for this. But I guess that's par for the course at this point.

For their lords to create fortifications for the kingdom? Sure. Conscription existed and still exists in some countries. Hey! Even our modern soldiers have an engineering department. The do not get paid over their usual wage for any work they do and yet they do build bridges and what not in times of war. In medieval fantasy world where the next invasion might be tomorrow. There are bound to have people working and being conscripted preemptively. That was done in our own world. This was called mandatory military service.

And desertion is very different when instead of just being a bandit with a knife, you can call down the forces of nature to raze villages to the ground. But, hey, willful ignorance and not even understanding my post is just par for the course at this point.

5ed is particularly silent on the NPC side of things. All you get is from the players' perspectives. Expanses of a kingdom and how they work are not defined. A DM in 5ed is left more or less in the dark or must rely either on homebrew or old material. But using the PHB on this is relatively pointless as these are the prices the players will pay.


Also. How much does 200 gold and incense actually costs? This is the price the players are expected to pay. But how much will the kingdom actually pay for these? 100 gold? That would be 50% players are expected to sell at about 10% to 25% the full price. A vendor/buyer will not buy for more than he will be able to acquire under "normal" means. Assuming parity of costs, it means that the acquiring costs is more akin to 50 gold. Add in bulk orders and you might even save an additional 10 to 15% bringing the costs around 43 golds (rounded up). Not the tremendous amount you are claiming.

Still, using the PHB is homebrewing what we should get from a rule expansion book. At best, it is an extrapolation of what we might see, at worst (and not meant as a pejorative here) pure homebrew. Maybe in the future we will get a book called barony, kingdom and empire creation? Until then, each DMs are on their own.

Using the PHB is homebrewing? Wow. I thought I'd seen it all. You are just flat out shameless.

 

[Chaosmancer]

If we're assuming a high level wizard, he probably has a ton of money saved up or can go out and sell spells for a ton of money. 1st and 2nd level spells go for 10-50gp each. Imagine what a 4th or 5th level spell goes for. And high level wizards usually end up with whatever land they want for their towers. Rulers like to make friends of high level wizards. Very useful folks to have on your good side.

Why common? I mean, 5e RAW says spellcasters are relatively rare, but even with that if you have enough money you can make it happen. Rich people play rock stars(big names) to play at their parties, and there's only 1 of any given rock star in the world. Money talks.

The point was that Helldritch claimed that the wizard was going around enchanting jail cells in small villages to pay his taxes. But, with the amount of wealthy they would need for that service to be their tax load (at 10% taxes) they would have to be one of the wealthiest people in the country.

Tell me, how likely are you to see Zuckerberg in smalltown, USA running an IT hotline? That's the modern equivalence


Of course, he's now claimed that using the PHB to show the prices of things is homebrewing, so continuing the discussion is obviously pointless

Except for very rare exceptions, small villages probably won't even have locks that are that good. You don't need much more for the town drunk or some locals who got into a fight.

You obviously haven't been following the discussion. I said I had a character who escaped from a sheriff who beat them.

Helldritch said that was impossible. Because you have to be at least level 4 to survive the Glyph of Warding placed on the lock of the jail cell by the Court Wizard to pay his taxes. The one set to explode with the Blight Spell (to prevent dexterity saves) if anything other than the proper key is put into.

That's the MINIMUM level of security for a village according to his posts.

 

[Maxperson]

The point was that Helldritch claimed that the wizard was going around enchanting jail cells in small villages to pay his taxes. But, with the amount of wealthy they would need for that service to be their tax load (at 10% taxes) they would have to be one of the wealthiest people in the country.

Tell me, how likely are you to see Zuckerberg in smalltown, USA running an IT hotline? That's the modern equivalence

That's not the issue. Offer Zuckerberg 100 million and he'll show up in a town of 300. The issue is that the town probably can't afford the wizard.

You obviously haven't been following the discussion. I said I had a character who escaped from a sheriff who beat them.

Good God man. Can't you just stop with the arguing for the sake of arguing? I agreed with you in multiple posts, including one where I quoted you that a character should be able to escape as part of their background. So yes, I have obviously been following the discussion.