D&D 5E Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards 5e

[Treantmonklvl20]

While I enjoy Treatmonk's guide, the most useful guide I've seen (that was for another game) was a step by step walkthrough of a character's life. In it, the author walked through character creation, advancement, etc... and talked about the decision making process whenever the PC made meaningful decisions. Within it, the context of decision making was evident - which is something that is hard to account for whe you're just talking about whether something is good or bad.

This is a good idea.

Now I think it's hard to come up for general rules that apply to all builds, but taking a single build from level 1-20 and discuss the decision making at each level up I think is very good. Of course, those decisions change based on the class and specifics of the build, but that guide could at least show you the thought process at each level.

90% of the guides I start writing never go anywhere, usually because I can't come up with a good way to organize them in a meaningful way. That said, I've been working on a concept where I take 3 builds, and follow a process similar to this. I was working on an archery guide that would follow a "Stealthy woodlands archer" an "arcane casting archer" and a "hand crossbow dpr specialist" over 20 levels.

However, maybe I might start with a guide that makes 3 more varied builds. A God Wizard, and maybe a Hexblade gish and something else. I'll have to give it some thought...

 

[Cascade]

Wizard on Wizard combat isn't going to happen. It will be a party vs a single wizard or party vs wizard + other baddies. The tactic "concentrate on the wizard" is hardly new, but there's a reason we all know it. You get one counterspell a round, if you are being ganged up on, you may need to dimension door out or go down.

I've been playing 5e since it started and I've played almost every AL adventure...it seems to happen quite often.
The main big bad guy is a high level caster hidden behind beefy minions. The usual tactic has been to get a fast toon to the caster but that doesn't always work. And with all of the additional actions in the boss economy; lair, legendary saves, even extra reactions, the counter process or mage direct to mage doesn't work. Applying indirect damage to casters (causing con checks) by being out of line of sight and then moving back in line of sight to counter their shields, seems to work best.

As a judge, encounters with casters and players as casters, there will be counter spells. I play predominately casters and controlling line of sight changes the game.

 

[TomFinn]

Maybe even 4 times, as it is area!

 

[jgsugden]

I've been playing 5e since it started and I've played almost every AL adventure...it seems to happen quite often.
The main big bad guy is a high level caster hidden behind beefy minions. The usual tactic has been to get a fast toon to the caster but that doesn't always work. And with all of the additional actions in the boss economy; lair, legendary saves, even extra reactions, the counter process or mage direct to mage doesn't work. Applying indirect damage to casters (causing con checks) by being out of line of sight and then moving back in line of sight to counter their shields, seems to work best.

As a judge, encounters with casters and players as casters, there will be counter spells. I play predominately casters and controlling line of sight changes the game.

I agree that there is some merit to the idea of a tactics discussion for how to deal with an enemy spellcaster as a wizard. You could put that in any class guide (it is a concern for fighters, monks and clerics just as much as for wizards) - but (IMHO) it isn't really the focus of these types of guides. These focus on "building" decisions, not "playing" decisions. References to spells being a good option as they can help you deal with an enemy spellcaster fit right in. Discussions of how to locate your PC so that it can avoid having its spell countered is a bit off focus. Not so much that it would be an error to include it, but enough so that it is not something you really need to include... or something you can really cover comprehensively in a reasonable page length. I could write 1000 pages on 5E wizard strategy and still have a bunch to spout off on....

 

[smbakeresq]

I agree that there is some merit to the idea of a tactics discussion for how to deal with an enemy spellcaster as a wizard. You could put that in any class guide (it is a concern for fighters, monks and clerics just as much as for wizards) - but (IMHO) it isn't really the focus of these types of guides. These focus on "building" decisions, not "playing" decisions. References to spells being a good option as they can help you deal with an enemy spellcaster fit right in. Discussions of how to locate your PC so that it can avoid having its spell countered is a bit off focus. Not so much that it would be an error to include it, but enough so that it is not something you really need to include... or something you can really cover comprehensively in a reasonable page length. I could write 1000 pages on 5E wizard strategy and still have a bunch to spout off on....

This is true also, in fact I play Monks as Mage Killers as a carry over from previous editions although you can’t just grapple them to death like before.

The caster anything behind his minions is the archetype, what makes creatures like the Tarrasque unique IMO is it “it can’t be bargained with, or reasoned with, it doesn’t feel pain, or pity, or remorse, and it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead.” Creatures like that often will confuse a group even though they must simply be beaten to death.

 

[Mooseberg0620]

Question! Wizard (Diviner) taking a level of Bard, is it a good idea? Also SOS, I have little to know idea what Im doing.

Ive only ever Multi classed in 4e where it was a feat, much less with a spell caster. My character Sigrunn, recently got a fancy gown (the dice deemed it so.) and the dice also deemed that she rather liked it (though she's growing into it).

She has a reasonable Cha as it is (14), but I'd be trying to grab "lousy" spells, spells that dont rely on her Cha very much. (was hoping for Mage armor, but alas.) She is currently level 2, I figure that she wants to wait till after 4 to grab the level, but again Ive never done this.

 

[Ancalagon]

Question! Wizard (Diviner) taking a level of Bard, is it a good idea? Also SOS, I have little to know idea what Im doing.

Ive only ever Multi classed in 4e where it was a feat, much less with a spell caster. My character Sigrunn, recently got a fancy gown (the dice deemed it so.) and the dice also deemed that she rather liked it (though she's growing into it).

She has a reasonable Cha as it is (14), but I'd be trying to grab "lousy" spells, spells that dont rely on her Cha very much. (was hoping for Mage armor, but alas.) She is currently level 2, I figure that she wants to wait till after 4 to grab the level, but again Ive never done this.

It could make for an interesting character, but is there a point to doing this besides roleplaying? What will you gain from that level of bard?

I can propose 2 alternatives:

1: making a wizard with the background of "entertainer"

2: Taking the feat "magic initiate" and learning a bit of bardic magic.

 

[jgsugden]

Multiclassing as a wizard slows down your progress towards higher level spells... and from an effectiveness standoint, it is a huge cost.

However, if it makese sense for your character to have some bard in him, that cost is worth it. You don't have to be the most effective PC to be a fun PC. And, I would rather have a fun diviner/bard than a super effective but less interesting pure diviner.

 

[Mooseberg0620]

actually what Im mostly after are skills and proficiency as well as flavor.

Seeing the drop in my spells, maybe prodigy is a better bet.

 

[smbakeresq]

A level in knowledge cleric helps with the skills. You get armor too and guidance spell, which helps with every skill.