D&D (2024) Uncommon items - actually common?

[pemerton]

I'm pretty certain that most household tool accidents don't result in an amputation.

They're not working with Black and Decker here.

Fair enough (unless they're magical tools!).

But then why would they need the potion of healing? With certain unhappy but fairly rare exceptions, the injury will clot on its own.

 

[pemerton]

So it turns out Gygax doesn't practice what he preaches. We all knew this.

Huh? What did he preach that he's contradicting here? His PHB and DMG are full of explanations of why the game mechanics (hp, saving throws, XP) don't themselves represent in-fiction causal processes.

 

[pemerton]

You can live without a finger or a leg, but only if you survive the blood loss and infection. That's what the potion's for.

But a healing potion doesn't stop infection, does it? That would require cure disease or similar!

 

[pemerton]

Whatever game you're using would do for a better healing system.

Well, in my currently-preferred FRPG - Torchbearer 2e - characters can become Sick and/or Injured, which impose a debuff, and can be recovered by resting, or healed via Healing skill (with the difficulty depending on the nature and seriousness of the sickness or injury).

In this system there is no generic "healing potion". There are potions that alleviate Injury, that alleviate Sickness, that alleviate Exhaustion, etc. The ones that alleviate Sickness and Injury are reasonably hard to make (and correspondingly hard to purchase - the system uses a uniform resolution framework, so purchasing and making can be put onto a common scale of difficulty).

 

[Mirrorrorrim]

This is a very common comparison IME. My groups do the same thing.


This, however, is were we differ in preference. The concept of a "common" magic item should not exist. Personally, in a fantasy game, I don't like the magical equivalent to the modern conveniences we enjoy.

Even a potion of healing, which in 5E terms, recovers a commoner from 0 hp to 4 hp every single time (healing a minimum of 4 hp), should be an item rarely seen. At 50 gp (or $5,000) that is not nearly enough cost to represent the idea of an item so rarely seen by a commoner.

If we look at the 2014 PHB, a "comfortable" lifestyle is 2 gp / day. Such a person must make at least that amount to maintain their lifestyle; a skilled blacksmith is good example. Now, a "modest" lifestyle is 1 gp / day. If our blacksmith choose to live a modest lifestyle, they would save 1 gp / day over what they make. In under two months, they could afford that potion of healing. For me, that is too easy and too low. If they saved an entire year's worth of workdays (say 250 days) and had 250 gp, that would be more reasonable to my liking for a potion of healing. At 250 gp, a potion of healing is also something no PC could begin the game with, but a party might pool their initial resources to have one in the group.

So, it is easy enough for myself to adapt for my games when compared to 5E's design. No "common" magical items at all. "Convenience" magical items do not exist in that sense. For all other magical items, I can multiply the buy / create costs by a factor of x5 and I can deal with that; I would also double the time factors.

I'm tired of worlds where everything is grimy and sad and does not actually reflect what a world would look like if Good and Evil were objectively, metaphysically real, with the many "Good" religions having access to divine magic and insights to advise and help people.

My home campaign is a world where the "Good" religions are actually, and measurably good, and the good pantheon of organized religions use their divine magic to systemically build and support civilized society. The faiths/religions/churches dedicated to light, community, justice, protection, joy, healing, and mercy do not send people into poverty to get help. They literally have divine magic to help people. They can create water, and food, and drink, and they even work with the local druids who help keep the breadbasket bountiful. Good people treat others with kindness and respect, even other faiths that are slightly different.

I say all that because if you are in a civilized settlement with a good church, people who get seriously injured are healed. It doesn't cost money. It merely costs free, daily renewable resources (spell slots or abilities). Spare the dying means you stop dying! You are healed to the point that you just need a night's rest! Being loved and supported is one of the reasons there are faithful who attend those churches.

Now in the PHB, a 50g potion is an item on the equipment list that costs less than a riding horse. Most people still won't have one. But it's primary purpose is to have healing when you're critically injured, or are away from civilization. I want the greater wilds and frontiers and untamed lands to be dangerous. Need to travel a long distance through dangerous terrain? That is when you want to have one.

That said, I like my campaign setting having a little anachronism.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Fair enough (unless they're magical tools!).

But then why would they need the potion of healing? With certain unhappy but fairly rare exceptions, the injury will clot on its own.

Falls, farm animals, animal attack.

I've seen plenty of injuries that were bad without costing the limb or would cause a life-long impairment in the timeframe of the game's implied setting.

 

[kigmatzomat]

For me, it's about access and control.

1. First of all, is it something a person can even afford? How much money does a commoner really have after paying for their food and shelter? Will they spend their life savings on anything that does not make their lives easier?
2. Second, is it a dangerous and controlled item? Does it blast people and set fires? Or does it just help you jump and swim better?

In my world, 1g is roughly equivalent to $100. Therefore...

• A riding horse for 75g is effectively $7,500. Not everyone owns a riding horse.
• A Common magic item worth 50g equals $5,000. Is there a non-dangerous magic item that a commoner is willing to spend that much money on? Would they rather save for a horse or have a common magic item?

50gp is the cost of Continual Flame or Clothes of Mending

• Is it an elf, dwarf or gnome who knows they would spend more than 1,000gp on candles/oil/torches or hundreds of gold on clothes over their lifespan?
• How about all the people who have long winter nights? Or the polar lands where night can last days or weeks and you need your clothes to last?
• Mines? Subterranean dwellers who need light and can't readily get cloth?
• Ships that would like to not catch fire? Sailors who would like to not look like ragamuffins?
• People who live in areas without supplies wood or oil or cloth, like deserts and mountains?

• . An Uncommon broom of flying is effectively buying a slow, flying bicycle. A bag of holding is also Uncommon. You can have 5 horses and 25g left over for this amount. Which would a commoner rather have?

Brooms of flying don't suffer from difficult terrain penalties and they get to travel "as the crow flies". So they are not particularly slow.

• Are they an elf, dwarf or gnome who knows they would need to buy a couple dozen horses over their lifetime?
• Are they a Small race who isn't comfortable on a horse, where a broom is faster than a pony?
• Do they live near a swamp where horses are alligator attractors and boats are tediously poled between bogs?
• Do they live in or near mountains where elevation changes are laborious?
• Do they live in rocky terrain, possibly undeground, that doesn't have enough fodder or water to support a horse or camel?

How about a shovel that casts Mold Earth 3.5ish times a day? (d6 charge recovery) Did you know it takes a human something like 6 solid hours to dig out 125cf of dirt with a steel shovel? That's like 0.7gp/day of labor...forever. Any town, estate or big farm has an endless amount digging that needs to be done. It pays for itself in 2 years.

 

[ezo]

I'm tired of worlds where everything is grimy and sad and does not actually reflect what a world would look like if Good and Evil were objectively, metaphysically real, with the many "Good" religions having access to divine magic and insights to advise and help people.

Nothing says the two have to be mutually exclusive.

You can still have a world with Good and Evil, with mystical and magical creatures, etc. but where magical items are not common and prevalent in the world so that Joe Smith the blacksmith can save up for a potion of healing in less than two months.

 

[Mirrorrorrim]

50gp is the cost of Continual Flame or Clothes of Mending

• Is it an elf, dwarf or gnome who knows they would spend more than 1,000gp on candles/oil/torches or hundreds of gold on clothes over their lifespan?
• How about all the people who have long winter nights? Or the polar lands where night can last days or weeks?
• Miners and subterranean dwellers?
• Ships that would like to not catch fire?
• People who live in areas without supplies wood or oil, like deserts and mountains?

Brooms of flying don't suffer from difficult terrain penalties and they get to travel "as the crow flies". So they are not particularly slow.

• Are they an elf, dwarf or gnome who knows they would need to buy a couple dozen horses over their lifetime?
• Are they a Small race who isn't comfortable on a horse, where a broom is faster than a pony?
• Do they live near a swamp where horses are alligator attractors and boats are tediously poled between bogs?
• Do they live in or near mountains where elevation changes are laborious?
• Do they live in rocky terrain, possibly undeground, that doesn't have enough fodder or water to support a horse or camel?

How about a shovel that casts Mold Earth 3.5ish times a day? (d6 charge recovery) Did you know it takes a human something like 6 solid hours to dig out 125cf of dirt with a steel shovel? That's like 0.7gp/day of labor...forever. Any town, estate or big farm has an endless amount digging that needs to be done. It pays for itself in 2 years.

That's exactly right! That is the purpose of those magical objects in the world.

If a commoner has the money, and they have the acumen and access to invest in such resources, they may just do that. But if they don't have the money, or have other financial obligations or money sinks (family, debts, setbacks, drinking, gambling, or other entertainment), it's a moo point. It's outside of their reach, or it they just don't see the value compared to anything else they think they need their money for.

It's really easy for a Player to know the "rules" of a world and whiteroom metagame it. It's another when the table acknowledges NPCs don't have the same "system mastery".

Also commoners have to be careful if they have something small and valuable that unscrupulous folk may covet. It could be quite easy for all that value to disappear because they are an easy target/mark with a big payout.

 

[kigmatzomat]

Yeah, the "wide magic" principle that Eberron pioneered really seems to have taken hold. Magic is pervasive, though not as cheap and omnipresent as technology is in the modern world. Instead of a world where kings have court archmages and peasants scrabble around like medieval farmers, the magic is spread a little more evenly.

Just a note, in 1993 Earthdawn had a setting with flying ships, cities with glowing crystal street lamps, cooking food in magical slow cookers and keeping their leftovers edible in cold chests. They had "targeting eyes" that replaced your meat-eye with a sniper crystal. Crystal limbs, armor and claws.

They also made all the d&d tropes "in-game". People introduce themselves as 4th Circle Warriors or 5th Circle Wizards. The majority of people used "half-magic", while PCs were Adepts. (And adepts could not use half-magic). Adepts could learn magic that made them harder to kill (wizards toughness was weaker than fighters). Casters could only have a few spells "prepared" in matrices (that kept demons from cursing you). Weaving spell threads was time consuming and easily disrupted. It also introduced "attunement" as Adepts had to weave threads to items.

Eberron's setting was highly unique, but that the "magitech" society wasn't where it was pioneering.

I am sure someone can point to something earlier than Earthdawn.