Well, I Went Ahead and Did It

[InzeladunMaster]

Well, I did it. I went ahead and ordered [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Dungeons-Dragons-Core-Rulebook-Gift/dp/0786950633/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1215624386&sr=8-1"]4th edition[/ame] to see if I like it or not.

 

[BobProbst]

I browsed it at the game store yesterday. It's definately different. The way it's presented in the book, character creation is much more modular with a variety of options to choose from but none of it seemed an improvement. Obviously I can't judge just from reading and I didn't look into multiclassing which I understand has been made less crippling.

Has an SRD been released?

 

[Fyrestryke]

Not the SRD we're used to seeing for 3.5. I'm not sure it's been released yet. There's a framework for it at the Wizards site, but it has no information in it. That was a week or two ago when I looked.

That's the set I got. I haven't actually seriously dug into it, but from glancing at it, it looks nice. Trying it out will be the real test.

EDIT - According to the GSL FAQ - http://wizards.com/d20/files/4EGSLFAQ061708.pdf

Q: What is the System Reference Document (SRD)?
A: The SRD is a reference document detailing Terms, Tables and Templates that are
available for license under the GSL. It is a reference document and not a reprinting of the
rules.

So, the SRD lists everything you can use under the GSL, but you have to pull that information from the Core books.

 

[thormagni]

So, the SRD lists everything you can use under the GSL, but you have to pull that information from the Core books.

My understanding is that it is even more restrictive than that. While you can reference the terms in your work, you can't actually pull the rules from your book. So while you could list your monster's stats, you couldn't explain what any of those stats MEAN under the new GSL. They specifically don't want third party publishers creating substitutes for the core books.

 

[BobProbst]

I think that the 3.x SRDs did more to help promote d20 (and advance sales) than anything else. It made the information readily available to people who otherwise wouldn't have joined the hobby and allowed 3rd parties to enrich the multiverse.

Trying to keep such tight control over the system is sure to backfire. Torrented pdfs are available by now for anyone who wants them -- they can't fight the dissemination of the information but they can embrace the way people want to use it. Nothing will dampen the enthusiasm for D&D like trying to contain it. D&D players always have enjoyed the creative freedom it allowed.

 

[InzeladunMaster]

Obviously I can't judge just from reading and I didn't look into multiclassing which I understand has been made less crippling.

Here is what a user had to say on Amazon about multiclassing:

"4) Multiclassing is non-existent. Multiclassing was another area that WOTC felt was too "scary" for players, so they removed it. The 4ed system for multiclassing instead more closely resembles the Arcane Disciple feat from 3ed -- it allows classes to gain a certain number of spells and powers from other classes. However, you never actually can become a member of the other class. When I tried making three character concepts in 4ed D&D I was thrown up against this wall in two of them -- the system just isn't powerful enough to carry out the builds I wanted."

 

[InzeladunMaster]

Torrented pdfs are available by now for anyone who wants them.

I don't think I have ever seen the word "torrent" as a past tense verb. What does this mean?

 

[Grimhelm]

I believe it refers to a bit torrent, some sort of computer term, however I do not believe it is correct to use it as a verb... though our language changes, especially around technology, so it may be used in this context at the present time without being widespread.

 

[thormagni]

I don't think I have ever seen the word "torrent" as a past tense verb. What does this mean?

Assuming this isn't a rhetorical question: a "torrent" is a small text file that when used in conjunction with a BitTorrent program allows users to download files across the 'Net. So, Bob would be suggesting that someone has made PDF files of the books available on the Web for download.

I agree that Wizards seems to be cutting off their own noses here, by discouraging third parties from going to town with 4th edition the way they did with 3rd and 3.5e. From a personal example, there were several systems I preferred for various genres before D20 came out. Now, my preferences are all D20 variants tailored to a given genre, such as Mutants & Masterminds for superheroes (instead of, say, Hero)

It could just be me, but 4th edition seems tailored to a very specific type of gaming experience and is less open-ended than other versions of D&D. I have the PH and the DMG and I have yet to see anything that makes me want to start playing the game -- certainly nothing that makes me want to give up 3.5. It just feels very rigid to me.

I suspect that while D20/3e/3.5e exerted a very unifying force on the gaming industry, the 4th edition version will cause a massive splintering again. I know I plan to support Paizo's Pathfinder game, rather than 4th edition.

 

[thormagni]

I really see the Wizards/4th edition/D20 situation much like the personal computer industry of 15-20 years ago. They don't want to become IBM in the PC market - watching other people profit and take over a market that they actually created, nurtured and designed.