What do you miss about AD&D 1e?

[beeber]

nisarg, you said the phrase i was thinking of--"high mortality but high reward". that element has defined my rpg experiences from the start. my first character: basic d&d thief. the place: keep on the borderlands. 20' inside the first lair, a pit trap i failed to spot triggered and killed my character. and we kept playing. i rolled up a new pc and we were off.

of course, there was the whole "new experience" thing w/ d&d which made it fresh and keeps the nostalgia going. but the anything-goes, anything can happen and you might get killed in the next encounter (but if not, there will be tons o' loot) feel is gone. everything is too balanced, too vanilla. i like vanilla in my ice cream (and rum!) but not in "adventure".

 

[Azul]

What do I miss about 1e?

- The quality of the bindings on those book (near indestructable)
- The price of those books ($12.95 Canadian for a hardcover rulebook)
- The "magic" and novelty of the game (I was still a kid and nothing in gaming felt cliche yet)

I wish I could say the simplicity and speed, but that would be a lie. 1e AD&D was clunky as hell due to the zillions of poorly structured rules. The way 1e DMG's structure (or lack thereof) is particularly baffling. Types of gems and the ways to cure lycanthropy listed dozens of pages before the explanation of how to run combat... sure... why not?

For speedy and simply gameplay, I'd have to give prize to Basic/Expert D&D. The D&D Cyclopedia is still to this day the best set of D&D rules for quick and simple "beer and pretzels" D&D.

3e D&D is really the heir of AD&D so it's more expansive and complex, which is fine so long as you want that added level of detail. Played with only the 3 Core Rules books, it almost reminds me of Basic/Expert D&D... almost.

 

[Akrasia]

...

For speedy and simply gameplay, I'd have to give prize to Basic/Expert D&D. The D&D Cyclopedia is still to this day the best set of D&D rules for quick and simple "beer and pretzels" D&D.

...

I love beer and pretzels. And I love consuming beer and pretzels while playing in a campaign with simple -- but creativity-facilitating -- rules that let you play from 1st level to 36th level.

Rules Cylcopedia remains the best version of D&D IMO.

Why would anyone want to play D&D without beer and pretzels (or at least beer)?

 

[Remathilis]

While I did miss the 1e game in its prime, I've read enough to say this:

1e was raw. Gritty. Unwashed and unkempt. It felt like, even in its youth, a grizzled veteran of countless wargames and fantasy novels.

It was elitist and proud of the fact that to truely appriciate it you needed knowledge of wargaming, medieval history, and fairy tales.

It wasn't concerned with balance as long as it fit the concept. A class was an arch-type and vise versa.

The cliche's weren't cliche yet. It ripped whole-sale from various fantasy sources unapologetically (Tolken hobbits fighting with Arthurian paladins and clerics of Odin against Lovecraftian ghouls).

It fit together like a car model kit; simple in its basic concept but more than ready to be kit-bashed together with the latest rules, and who cares if it doesn't fit nicely as long as it looks cool?

It closely mimiced the genre that spawned it in only the way a small, relatively niche company like TSR could.

It concerned itself with being a game and left role-playing as the component the player added.

It didn't preach for a specific type of playing style. Who cared if you were CE and kicked puppies for fun when your in a dungeon fighting kobolds so you could get to level 3 and a +1 sword? Heroism, and scripted modules, were the DM's perogative.

All in all, 1e seemed more like a NICHE HOBBY, something for afficenados and people who liked fantasy to play. Since then, its popularity has forced it to grow up into a respectable GENERAL HOBBY that can be sold to a global market. That meant more emphasis on generalized rules, balance, and some (painful) seperation from very genre that spawned it (like the un-hobbiting of halflings). In a sense, D&D has become less of a rebelous teenager on a saturday night racing and picking up girls to a man with a job, morgage, and a "I know better" attitude.

Kinda like some of its players.

 

[VirgilCaine]

The way 1e DMG's structure (or lack thereof) is particularly baffling. Types of gems and the ways to cure lycanthropy listed dozens of pages before the explanation of how to run combat... sure... why not?

There is an index, you know. But still, I just use it for the gems and the herbs and the other tables like that. I definitely wouldn't want to actually play the game using it.

 

[Azul]

I love beer and pretzels. And I love consuming beer and pretzels while playing in a campaign with simple -- but creativity-facilitating -- rules that let you play from 1st level to 36th level.

Rules Cylcopedia remains the best version of D&D IMO.

Why would anyone want to play D&D without beer and pretzels (or at least beer)?

I run a campaign with 8 PCs. I don't let them near beer during our regular gaming nights. It's hard enough keeping that large a group moving without having tipsy players. :\

Coffee and coke (anything with caffeine) are our usual beverages. Living less than 50m away from a coffee/doughnut shop helps. During our mid-session break, we do coffee and doughnut runs.

I have a deep fondness of the Cyclopedia, but part of that is because it is based on Basic edition D&D. That was the first RPG I ever played. I also loved the weapon expertise rules that were introduced in the Master set rules (and included in the cyclopedia). It gave each weapon a distinct flavour. Being a grandmaster with any weapon gave you all sorts of funky abilities and sick damage. Sure, you can recreate those effects using feats in 3.5, but I liked that package deal.

Cyclopedia rules are what I'd pull out for a one-night dungeon bash, along with the beer and pretzels. For a long-term campaign where I want more depth (and more flexibility in the game mechanics), I'll use 3.5 edition. It's not perfect, but it is the best *overall* version of D&D yet published. Kind of a swiss army knife to the cyclopedia's simple straightforward jackknife.

 

[Akrasia]

...Coffee and coke (anything with caffeine) are our usual beverages. Living less than 50m away from a coffee/doughnut shop helps. During our mid-session break, we do coffee and doughnut runs.

Is the coffee/doughnut shop Tim Horton's? I'm Canadian, and I miss the "coffee/doughnut-shops-on-every-corner" requirement of Canadian urban geography. Sure there's the occasional Krispy Kreme down here, but it isn't quite the same...

...
Cyclopedia rules are what I'd pull out for a one-night dungeon bash, along with the beer and pretzels. For a long-term campaign where I want more depth (and more flexibility in the game mechanics), I'll use 3.5 edition. It's not perfect, but it is the best *overall* version of D&D yet published. Kind of a swiss army knife to the cyclopedia's simple straightforward jackknife.

I run a 3.x campaign now -- the group I found in the Bay area when I moved here insisted on it -- but I long for the days of my RC D&D campaign. We seemed to get so much more done in every session with RC D&D, and the prep-time as DM was much less. (In fact, given the demands or work, etc., I will probably have to give up DM'ing 3.x after the current story-line.) In terms of campaign plot and character development, both campaigns have been equally successful. But with RC D&D, we seemed to get so much more done.

My hope is that Castles and Crusades will combine the flexibility of 3.x with the speed and "rules-lite-framework" of RC D&D.

 

[snarfoogle]

I miss the unexpected and new. "Wait... these are elves... and they're evil? DUBYA TEE EFF MATE!"

 

[Aaron L]

Why would anyone want to play D&D without beer and pretzels (or at least beer)?

I would NEVER want to play D&D with beer.

 

[Veritas]

Playing d6 Star Wars with beer was lots of fun, but I've never played D&D with it. Coke and pizza and chips were the consumables of choice. heh.