D&D 5E What (if anything) do you find "wrong" with 5E?

[Hussar]

Yes, I couldn't stand many of these fixes. They didnt work for me. Some of that is a mechanical perspective, and much of it is a subjective taste perspective. That doesn't make me a child, or stupid, or an a hole. I really want to extend an olive branch to 4E folks because I know y'all got an unfair shake and mountain of crap you didnt deserve, but postings like these makes it really, really, difficult.

Sorry. If I implied, suggested or in any way said that I thought you were a child, stupid or an a-hole I unreservedly apologize. It certainly was not my intent.

Now I agree that some of the ways they fixed the problems were not without their own problems. I don’t want verbatim skill challenge rules plunked down in 5e for example.

But I wouldn’t mind something inspired by them either. The current direction of group challenges, maybe with a bit more guidelines and a smidgeon more complexity (maybe guidelines for extending group challenges over time for example) would make me a happy camper.

I’m not one to say we should port whole cloth 4e mechanics. But I think there is a strong current of immediate rejection as soon as something starts to resemble 4e too much. Again too much baby with the bath water.

 

[payn]

Sorry. If I implied, suggested or in any way said that I thought you were a child, stupid or an a-hole I unreservedly apologize. It certainly was not my intent.

Now I agree that some of the ways they fixed the problems were not without their own problems. I don’t want verbatim skill challenge rules plunked down in 5e for example.

But I wouldn’t mind something inspired by them either. The current direction of group challenges, maybe with a bit more guidelines and a smidgeon more complexity (maybe guidelines for extending group challenges over time for example) would make me a happy camper.

I’m not one to say we should port whole cloth 4e mechanics. But I think there is a strong current of immediate rejection as soon as something starts to resemble 4e too much. Again too much baby with the bath water.

I accept your apology and issue one of my own for implying such strong opinions from your posting. I am a little sensitive, not just from your posting, but many this past week. I think we are reaching that point in an editions lifespan where opinions are starting to heat up again. It happened in 3E, 4E, PF1, 5E, and well its probably going to be an unfortunate part of the cycle for many fantasy RPGs. Everyone is anxious for the future, and it becomes a certain competition in the idea marketplace. I just let the heat get to me.

 

[Minigiant]

I find the game being balanced around 5-7 encounters in an adventuring day to be the worst thing about 5e.

That's a huge one.

Not having a toggle for 1-3 encounter days is a huge flaw of 5e.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I don't remember that, but I do remember sample stat blocks for Prestige Classed characters usually being terribad, with characters taking Feats they don't qualify for- or sometimes not meeting the requirements for their own class.

And usually official NPC stat blocks were laughable, like Drizzt and others in the first Forgotten Realms hardcover for 3e.

Well, if your standard is going to be that PCs and NPCs are fundamentally based on the same rules (which, to be clear, is a dynamic I prefer though it worked poorly in the end with D&D because of all the ruddy special casing) you don't get to be surprised when you pop out NPCs that don't, and that's not even getting into the problems with doing that with sample characters.

 

[overgeeked]

Something I wish I'd realised in 3e was that you didn't need to follow the rules for building monsters. It would have been so much easier to create something like an orc assassin if I just ignored the number of skill points/feats and just gave them some hit dice, base Stealth equal to level +3, and maybe a couple of feats to help with things, like two-weapon fighting and weapon focus (dagger) though even then, all you really need is the attack bonus for their attacks, no real need to list any feats. Even saving throws could have just been Fort/Will = half their level, Ref = their level. The ease of creating NPCs/Monsters is one of the things I really liked about 4e, and to a lesser extent 5e. 4e had a lot of the calculations for hit points and things essentially done for you.

Check out blog of holding. He did a 5E update for the MM on a business card post. The numbers line up almost perfectly to the official stats. A little tweak here and there and done. Makes monster design a snap.

5e monster manual on a business card

Lately I’ve been doing statistical analysis on D&D 5e monsters to see how they’re built, and I’ve learned some interesting things: the DMG monster-creation guidelines don&#821…

blogofholding.com

 

[Maxperson]

That's a huge one.

Not having a toggle for 1-3 encounter days is a huge flaw of 5e.

It's the one thing that has me periodically wondering if I should switch my group back to 3e. Another not nearly as big a deal, but negative for me and my group is the lack of a lot of high level monsters. If I don't want to do demons/devils/etc. or dragons or a crapton of lower CR creatures, there really aren't that many to pick from, and all my campaigns go to high level. The current group is 10th and my choices have dwindled dramatically.

 

[Minigiant]

Sadly, 5e has some monsters that punch above or below their CR, and I can't always figure out the reasons why, so once again I have to break out the magnifying glass to make sure a monster is actually able to challenge the player characters.

Because WOTC make a CR chart for the DMG then proceeded not to use it on any monster in the MM.

 

[Nightfly]

I think we are reaching that point in an editions lifespan where opinions are starting to heat up again. It happened in 3E, 4E, PF1, 5E, and well its probably going to be an unfortunate part of the cycle for many fantasy RPGs.

It really is remarkable how chippy people can get about these edition discussions. If someone started a thread here called "Why is your Mom such a bad prostitute?" I don't think people would get half as upset.

Anyway, I'm happy to see tempers are cooling.

 

[Eyes of Nine]

Why can't I multiclass with sub-classes? This is actually outside the purview of this thread, because it doesn't bug me in the same way having nothing to spend money on after 2nd level does. But really - why can't we multi-class to another sub-class in the same class?

 

[Hussar]

Check out blog of holding. He did a 5E update for the MM on a business card post. The numbers line up almost perfectly to the official stats. A little tweak here and there and done. Makes monster design a snap.

5e monster manual on a business card

Lately I’ve been doing statistical analysis on D&D 5e monsters to see how they’re built, and I’ve learned some interesting things: the DMG monster-creation guidelines don&#821…

blogofholding.com

See this? This right here is exactly the point I was making earlier. It took about ten (ish) years to do something that 4e did out of the box. Why? Because 5e rules are opaque and hidden while 4e's rules were clear and transparent. Thing is, you get EXACTLY the same results - being able to create monsters more or less on the fly with a minimum of fuss.

There is zero reason why this wasn't in the 5e DMG at the outset. This absolutely SHOULD have been there. The math is too clear and easy to follow for it to not have been deliberate. But, WotC couldn't do it back then because making the rules clear and transparent would result in the fandom losing their collective minds.

So, we had to take this rather roundabout journey, reinventing the wheel in order to get right back to where we were fifteen years ago.