D&D General What is appropriate Ranger Magic

Which of the following do you see as general Ranger spells?

  • Autumn Blades

    Votes: 5 10.2%
  • Beastmeld

    Votes: 9 18.4%
  • Blade Cascade

    Votes: 7 14.3%
  • Blade Thrist

    Votes: 5 10.2%
  • Bloodhounds

    Votes: 11 22.4%
  • Exploding Arrow

    Votes: 14 28.6%
  • Giant Axe

    Votes: 5 10.2%
  • Greenwood Linb

    Votes: 2 4.1%
  • Heatsight

    Votes: 8 16.3%
  • Implacable Pursuer

    Votes: 12 24.5%
  • Long Grasp

    Votes: 2 4.1%
  • Othrus

    Votes: 1 2.0%
  • Sense Fear

    Votes: 6 12.2%
  • Steel Skin

    Votes: 3 6.1%
  • Strength of the Beast

    Votes: 10 20.4%
  • Umbral Escape

    Votes: 6 12.2%
  • Wildtalk

    Votes: 12 24.5%
  • Wooden Escape

    Votes: 4 8.2%
  • Rangers should have no magic spells.

    Votes: 23 46.9%
  • Rangers should not have magic spells but not be limited to natural limits

    Votes: 13 26.5%
  • Rangers should have every more core magic spells.

    Votes: 5 10.2%

Rangers, like Paladins, should not be using magic spells.

This does not mean they should not be supernatural. They just should use other tools.

Really, there'd be a spectrum here, rather than two points ("spellcaster" or "not spellcaster"). Wizards would lie at one extreme end, being mostly spell-driven with minimal class features. As you move along the spectrum, you see more supernatural class features and fewer spells, e.g. Bard, Cleric, Druid, Warlock, until finally none at all (e.g. Artificer would probably lie just on the "has spells" side of that line). Then you have Paladin, Ranger, Monk, Assassin, etc., which are clearly supernatural, but not in a way that makes sense as "casting spells" natively, though I 100% support subclasses that cast spells for all of these classes! And finally you have Barbarian, Fighter, Rogue, Warlord, "Machinist" (still shopping for a name I like better), etc. which aren't really supernatural, but are beyond the limits of pure mundanity, aka what I like to call the "transmundane" by analogy to Cantor's "transfinite" concept--beyond the finite, but not necessarily infinite per se.

When coupled with a spectrum of different expected mechanical engagement (what is often loosely called "complexity") in every general region along this spectrum, you get something that is approachable, supports a wide variety of tastes and preferences, and doesn't pigeonhole particular thematics. Coupled with boundary-breaking subclasses, like Blade Warlocks that focus heavily on Fighter-like gameplay, an "Oath of the Quill" Paladin that learns spells, and Eldritch Knight Fighters, we'd actually be leveraging the design power behind subclasses and offering a better spectrum of options for players.

It would, of course, require somewhere between a slight and significant expansion of the number of classes, but I genuinely can't justify more than 12 additional classes beyond the 13 present in 5.0. Even that 12 required me to stretch my brain a little bit, so this is emphatically not a "oh, so now we're going to have 100+ classes?!!?!" kind of thing. Now I'm really digressing though, so I'll leave it there.

Edit: I will also note, although I voted only for "Rangers should not have magic spells...", some of your ideas are very thematic and cool @Minigiant. I would not at all be upset with seeing these things as bespoke supernatural Ranger actions that weren't spells.
 

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What about the Skirmish feature, and the Ambush master feature? Or Sudden Strike? Coupled with Tasha's features and a proprietary +damage feature? These are interesting and strong features!

Of course if you reduce those to just extra attack and faster movement, magic looks way better.

It's like saying "why spells? It's just 90 different ways to speak with grass and squirrels or had mediocre splash damage!".
They are interesting features. However the ranger has similar features to them already. They are are spells however. Except Sudden strike which is just extra attack.

However it's mostly rogue features and this ultimately created a ranger colored rogue. Just coming from the other direction: a green rogue vs a green fighter.

Because ultimately all it is is a fighter/rogue multiclass. Which begs the question.
 


Because ultimately all it is is a fighter/rogue multiclass. Which begs the question.
i really do think there should be some druid levels getting mixed into the pot there too for the ranger recipie.

there is a connection to the world around them in the building blocks of a ranger that a pure fighter/rogue mix simply doesn't achieve IMO, even with an 'urban city ranger' the ranger and their land share a special connection that borders on the mystic.
 

It is subtractive.

However the A5E Ranger Only has low tier wilderness exploration abilities because the entire game was written to force everybody to be stuck with only low tier wilderness expiration abilities and no way to expand them.

However in traditional D&D you eventually will go out of low tier wilderness. That will ignore those low tiers abilities.

A5e rewrite the entire system so that having a hut and fire still matter to a level 20 character. And I believe the majority of the D&D community do not want that. They want fantastic worlds where a simple hut and a torch or not the main gatekeeps to surviving the wilderness at all levels.

Fans expect some parties to delve into other planes like various hells, underworlds, and apocalypse planes as wells as frozen tundra, blasted wastes, and scorching deserts.. And thus you have to write a non-magical Ranger effect has the abilities to deal with that. You first have to discover what the hostile elements of these dangerous wildernesses. Then you have to figure out how a ranger can deal with those.

And often the issue becomes that people think up these planes so hostile that the people who design non-magical rangers do not equip them with their ability to deal with these wild spaces.

To be fair the magic arrangers typically aren't given all the magic to do it either. However they are given least more.
So what I'm hearing is that it doesn't work for you (which of course is fine) which you're trying to justify as more objective by claiming that most people agree with your opinion, and that somehow makes your feelings more valid than mine. Forgive me for not agreeing with you. Not sure what your endgame is here.
 


Many fans assume that the Ranger has to deal with some dentists of the wilderness like extreme animals, fey, dragons, and monsters summoned by cults. As well as harsh planescapes with various E
elemental, psychic, and weather hazards.

A5e mostly rewrites these as softer and less hostile than traditional or modern D&D.
Level Up is a new game with modern mechanics. Again not seeing what your trying to do here. According to you most people already feel rangers are supposed to be magical spellcasters.
 

The question being why have an actual Ranger class when you can role-play a fighter/rogue character instead? ;)
Because the ranger would have overt magic or supernatural abilities to deal with the wilderness.

So, what kind of class features would the A5e Ranger need to cover Tier 2 and above if all of their Tier 1 stuff was back in that tier?
Extreme weather- hurricanes, tornadoes, heatwaves, sleet storms
Extreme wilderness hazards- avalanches, rock slides, forest fires
Random wild arcane effects- living fireball, lightning snakes, warpstorms
Outer/Astral Planar effects
Inner/Elemental Planar effects
Fey trickery
Shadowfell gloom
Dragon lair effects
Barbaric tribal technology
Wandering army scouting
 

Because the ranger would have overt magic or supernatural abilities to deal with the wilderness.


Extreme weather- hurricanes, tornadoes, heatwaves, sleet storms
Extreme wilderness hazards- avalanches, rock slides, forest fires
Random wild arcane effects- living fireball, lightning snakes, warpstorms
Outer/Astral Planar effects
Inner/Elemental Planar effects
Fey trickery
Shadowfell gloom
Dragon lair effects
Barbaric tribal technology
Wandering army scouting
Aren't you getting the magical ranger you want in 5.5? As far as mainstream fantasy gaming goes (for those who value that), you basically already won.
 

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