What is the essence of D&D

[Lanefan]

I am of the mind that if you want the mechanics to fade away then simply do not have them. If the expectation is that we are going to spend our time engaging with discrete mechanics instead of the fiction directly then those mechanics should be salient and deeply engaging. What purpose do mechanics serve if not to create compelling game play and emergent story?

They mostly serve to keep things more or less in line, much like the rules of any game or sport.

Problem is, in some RPGs (including the RAW versions of every D&D edition incuding and after 1e) the mechanics threaten to become the game rather than simply serve it.

Proof: the very fact that char-ops (particularly in 3-4-5e) exists as a concept.

I want to play the game hard and play my character hard.

I guess I'm not that hardcore - I mostly want to kick back, have a laugh, get into character, entertain and be entertained, and just give 'er.

I also do not want to follow the story. I want to actively experience it and be part of creating it.

Shrug...if the DM has crafted an engaging plot or story, or we're in an interesting adventure, as a player I'll more or less go along with it. But if I get bored then I'll start creating story, and if I'm creating story it's probably going to involve chaos and mayhem sooner rather than later...

 

[Lanefan]

Really? Every group I ever played with in 2e used speed factors. Random initiative per round as well.

1e rather than 2e here, but I've never in my life used speed factors (or weapon type vs armour type) in any game I've run or played.

Random initiative each round, however, always has been and always will be hard-coded into the system.

 

[Garthanos]

We're nerds. It's serious business.

indeed why else would we bring up math

Let me see
.35 x2 +.35 x 2 +.35 x2 = 2.05 (mage probably hit)
.35 x2 +.35 x 2 +.35 x2 = 2.05 (mage probably hit)
.35 x2 +.35 x 2 +.35 x2 = 2.05 (mage probably hit)
three rounds likely 6.15 ... could interrupt an enemy spell caster
with even that first one could take out entirely kobold or various smaller ones even round one

Bastard sword from 1e is 2d4+1 (giving the 17 my fighter had in 1e)
.4x6 = 2.4 fighter probably didnt
.4x6 = 2.4 fighter fair chance but still not certain by now
.4x6 = 2.4 fighter has probably hit

The end result is a Mage could be pretty offensively effective

 

[Lanefan]

Against a party, yep. We're discussing how effective a 1st level reduced to darts wizard will compare in combat with a 1st level bastard sword fighter, though.

Carrion Crawlers kill you fast or die fast, They're squishy, and initiative matters.

Yeah, anything with multiple attacks gets an initiative for each attack here (including PCs), so a Crawler is very likely to get in one or two shots early on...which can mess up any party if the saves go south.

 

[Hussar]

You could double specialize and use weapons of equal length.

I never used combat and Tactics. Just the Fighter's Handbook

 

[Garthanos]

How did weapon speed factors even apply vs a Carrion Crawler ... DM might be calling those pincer Scimitar like speed factor 4?

 

[Zardnaar]

indeed why else would we bring up math

Let me see
.35 x2 +.35 x 2 +.35 x2 = 2.05 (mage probably hit)
.35 x2 +.35 x 2 +.35 x2 = 2.05
.35 x2 +.35 x 2 +.35 x2 = 2.05
three rounds likely 6.15 ... could interrupt an enemy spell caster
with even that first one could take out entirely kobold or various smaller ones even round one

Bastard sword from 1e is 2d4+1 (giving the 17 my fighter had in 1e)
.4x6 = 2.4 fighter probably didnt
.4x6 = 2.4 fighter fair chance but still not certain by now
.4x6 = 2.4 fighter has probably hit

The end result is a Mage could be pretty offensively effective

Throwing darts had several other uses.

1. Reasonable damage at low levels THAC0 difference was fine.

2. Interupted spells. 3 attacks only need to deal 1 damage, speed factor 2.

3. Countering stone skin spells.

 

[Zardnaar]

I never used combat and Tactics. Just the Fighter's Handbook

Page 64 fighters handbook.

 

[Zardnaar]

How did weapon speed factors even apply vs a Carrion Crawler ... DM might be calling those pincer Scimitar like speed factor 4?

Went on size of the monster.

 

[Garthanos]

Throwing darts had several other uses.

1. Reasonable damage at low levels THAC0 difference was fine.

2. Interupted spells. 3 attacks only need to deal 1 damage, speed factor 2.

3. Countering stone skin spells.

the first two I remembered not the last