What was Alternity like?
- Thread starter Narfellus
- Start date
Psion
Adventurer
Narfellus said:
Well, there's D&D 3e... a game you might have heard of.
Really, the primary resemblance between 3e and alternity was that skills ranks were limited to level + 3 (though levels in alternity were more a summary of how many points you had, vice something you cross reference on a table to get benefits) and that skills were split into "in class" and "cross class" in D&D terms.Characters has 6 stats that strongly resemble D20's, but the scale was smaller and it was strictly point buy. The system was a bit more skill based than d20 -- there were four "professions", but the biggest impact of those was which skills you got breaks on, though there was a short list of benefits each got.
The dice system in alternity is unusual. Instead of roll over, it is roll under. You could get ordinary, good, or amazing results, if your roll was under 1x, 1/2x, or 1/4x your total.
d20 was the basis of these rolls, but you added or subtracted (usually) a single dice from that d20. This has some interesting properties. For more detail on this, see my review on RPGnet:
http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_4132.html
(note that at the time, the RPGnet review server had a nasty habit of stripping out "+" signs -- wherever you see two dice noted next to each other, assume a "+" between them.)
DM_Jeff
Explorer
Alternity
Alternity was a great system indeed. At one point when WotC was announcing it's demise, it stated how many of the general components, and the lessons WotC learned developing Alternity lead directly to D&D 3.0 changes and development.
The die mechanic was unique, as Psion mentioned. At times the modifiers (of which there were alot at times) slowed things down a bit, but overall the game was close to perfect for our group.
Currently, http://www.alternityrpg.net/ is the official keeper of all things Alternity, and hosts loads of files, an overview of the system, and more.
-DM Jeff
Alternity was a great system indeed. At one point when WotC was announcing it's demise, it stated how many of the general components, and the lessons WotC learned developing Alternity lead directly to D&D 3.0 changes and development.
The die mechanic was unique, as Psion mentioned. At times the modifiers (of which there were alot at times) slowed things down a bit, but overall the game was close to perfect for our group.
Currently, http://www.alternityrpg.net/ is the official keeper of all things Alternity, and hosts loads of files, an overview of the system, and more.
-DM Jeff
This is both a responce to the thread originator and some expansions on comments made by Alan.
No, the hero has a maximum inital number of ranks of 3, but then there is no limit.
"Bit more"? Alternity is all skills based. If you want to ignore combat, you don't have to spend a single skill point in any of the 7 combat broad skills. And everyone can buy any skill- there is no exclusion at all.
MOGA- Marginal (for skill checks that can't fail), Ordinary, Good and Amazing for successes and Critical Failure (on a 20) and Failure round out the possibilities.
Let me write that again to emphasize it- almost everything in Alternity, except damage and armor rolls is a skill check. The rules allow for ability check like strength feat checks as well.
Each die size with a change is called a step and the dice used are d4, d6, d8, d12 and d20 (and then multiples of d20 after that). So if you have a 3 step bonus, you roll d20 and subtract a d8. If you have a 2 step penalty, you add a d6. Don't ask why d10 are excluded. Some of the house rules at A.net use a 2d8 in place of d20.
Armor is represented by a die roll that subtracts damage. Damage has 4 forms- stun, wound, mortal and fatigue.
Please, if you have more questions go to Alternityrpg.net and ask on the messageboard there. Usually there are 3-4 of us there at any one time (and that usually includes me under my name- Derek Holland). Also there are thousands of pages of rules, setting and other stuff by the fans in the resources section. WoTC may not support it anymore, but it is far from dead.
Psion said:Well, there's D&D 3e... a game you might have heard of.
No, the hero has a maximum inital number of ranks of 3, but then there is no limit.
"Bit more"? Alternity is all skills based. If you want to ignore combat, you don't have to spend a single skill point in any of the 7 combat broad skills. And everyone can buy any skill- there is no exclusion at all.
MOGA- Marginal (for skill checks that can't fail), Ordinary, Good and Amazing for successes and Critical Failure (on a 20) and Failure round out the possibilities.
Let me write that again to emphasize it- almost everything in Alternity, except damage and armor rolls is a skill check. The rules allow for ability check like strength feat checks as well.
Each die size with a change is called a step and the dice used are d4, d6, d8, d12 and d20 (and then multiples of d20 after that). So if you have a 3 step bonus, you roll d20 and subtract a d8. If you have a 2 step penalty, you add a d6. Don't ask why d10 are excluded. Some of the house rules at A.net use a 2d8 in place of d20.
Armor is represented by a die roll that subtracts damage. Damage has 4 forms- stun, wound, mortal and fatigue.
Please, if you have more questions go to Alternityrpg.net and ask on the messageboard there. Usually there are 3-4 of us there at any one time (and that usually includes me under my name- Derek Holland). Also there are thousands of pages of rules, setting and other stuff by the fans in the resources section. WoTC may not support it anymore, but it is far from dead.
evildmguy
Explorer
I think Psion summarized it a bit too much but I can understand that.
Alternity was very good for many, many reasons.
1 - Character creation - Step one was to have a character concept. This was a description of the character you wanted to play. This did need to be some what specific. It helped to have a background idea for your character. From this description, all other choices are made. And some of them can be quite different.
Also in character creation, the six attributes ranged from 4 - 14 and you had 60 points to distribute as you wanted. It only required an 11 to get a modifier. A lot more choices here.
Personality, i.e. Charisma, determined Last Resort Points, which made this a non throw away stat unless the player wanted no ability to effect their die rolls.
2 - Die rolls - The die roll mechanic is low, as was said, and had degrees of success. They also had a control die (the d20) and a situation die (another die but d10 wasn't used) to add or subtract from the roll. This gave a bit more of a bell curve. It did mean you still have to add up modifiers but that converted into a die to either add or subtract.
Degrees of success is such a HUGE thing that I don't know if I can adequately describe how it affected things.
Further, the game rules said that unless it was an exceptional, or heroic, circumstance, most of the time, rolls aren't needed. For me, again, that was huge. Instead of having to roll to learn or fix something, the character automatically does, unless it is a hurried situation.
3 - Skill based system - The profession of a character gave a bonus with regards to buying some skills. Otherwise, it is a skill based system, which means that any character can learn anything. It did get complicated to figure the cost but not overly so.
Skills were limited to 12 total ranks. With a 14 ability score, that would mean they would only fail if their total roll was LESS THAN 26! So, they would generally get the lowest success. However, it would take a LONG time to get that many ranks, even if the GM is generous with achievement points. And again, this isn't the norm but didn't ruin "game balance" (I hat that term) if someone has above a 20, imo.
Skills had "rank benefits" that automatically happened at certain ranks. They could be bought early if desired by the PC. There were some VERY good benefits with this! For example, after 4 ranks of pistol, the character can automatically draw and fire with no penalty.
4 - Advancement - all done via achievement points, and based on profession. Some skills and ability scores are easier for some professions to improve. Yes, ability scores could go up by two each.
There were perks and flaws, some of which could be gained after starting. Flaws could be bought off as well.
5 - Perks and flaws - They existed as part of the core rules. They worked to help flesh out the character. They did give game rules of how to run them, and some of them were quite good.
I am stopping here and I haven't even begun to scratch the surface of why Alternity was good. I am not talking about how skill effected damage, how a better roll meant better damage or how the game handled scaling very well. Without a very good understanding of the basics, none of these would make any sense.
The game was its own system and is very, very good. When I played a Fantasy game based on it last year, I only modified two small things. Otherwise, I used the system as is and the players enjoyed it a lot. So did I!
One reason that I like Alternity so much is because it helped shift the focus from the generic to the specific character. So, instead of being defined by "class" and "race", the character is defined by their background. We referred to character background a LOT when making decisions about the character.
Players got a lot more control over their character's actions, imo. It was much easier to succeed, if you really needed to. This allows a shift from the die rolling to the story telling and what is appropriate for the story by the rules. I like that.
Speaking of the rules, many rules in the GMG were about the story and what the GM wanted to do. If the GM wants a detailed combat system, it is there. If the GM just wants to eye ball it to keep the story moving, that is possible as well.
If Alternity had a more developed "magic" (FX) system, I would probably still be using it. Heck, if it had gotten one revision, which probably would have added what I wanted, I would still be using it. I will still use it as my first choice for Modern or SciFi gaming. For Fantasy, though, I found that Exalted fit my style better, so that's what I am using.
I know I didn't do the system justice but this isn't an easy task to describe a system. Further, some of the things I have learned after playing Alternity for years are tough to show or explain to a person who has just started. For example, Alternity has a much better "alignment" system, which is probably where they got the d20 Modern allegiance idea. It is tough to read this, though, and understand how it all works and fits together.
A good question! Thanks!
Have a good one! Take care!
edg
former Alternity pimp
current Exalted (WW) pimp
Alternity was very good for many, many reasons.
1 - Character creation - Step one was to have a character concept. This was a description of the character you wanted to play. This did need to be some what specific. It helped to have a background idea for your character. From this description, all other choices are made. And some of them can be quite different.
Also in character creation, the six attributes ranged from 4 - 14 and you had 60 points to distribute as you wanted. It only required an 11 to get a modifier. A lot more choices here.
Personality, i.e. Charisma, determined Last Resort Points, which made this a non throw away stat unless the player wanted no ability to effect their die rolls.
2 - Die rolls - The die roll mechanic is low, as was said, and had degrees of success. They also had a control die (the d20) and a situation die (another die but d10 wasn't used) to add or subtract from the roll. This gave a bit more of a bell curve. It did mean you still have to add up modifiers but that converted into a die to either add or subtract.
Degrees of success is such a HUGE thing that I don't know if I can adequately describe how it affected things.
Further, the game rules said that unless it was an exceptional, or heroic, circumstance, most of the time, rolls aren't needed. For me, again, that was huge. Instead of having to roll to learn or fix something, the character automatically does, unless it is a hurried situation.
3 - Skill based system - The profession of a character gave a bonus with regards to buying some skills. Otherwise, it is a skill based system, which means that any character can learn anything. It did get complicated to figure the cost but not overly so.
Skills were limited to 12 total ranks. With a 14 ability score, that would mean they would only fail if their total roll was LESS THAN 26! So, they would generally get the lowest success. However, it would take a LONG time to get that many ranks, even if the GM is generous with achievement points. And again, this isn't the norm but didn't ruin "game balance" (I hat that term) if someone has above a 20, imo.
Skills had "rank benefits" that automatically happened at certain ranks. They could be bought early if desired by the PC. There were some VERY good benefits with this! For example, after 4 ranks of pistol, the character can automatically draw and fire with no penalty.
4 - Advancement - all done via achievement points, and based on profession. Some skills and ability scores are easier for some professions to improve. Yes, ability scores could go up by two each.
There were perks and flaws, some of which could be gained after starting. Flaws could be bought off as well.
5 - Perks and flaws - They existed as part of the core rules. They worked to help flesh out the character. They did give game rules of how to run them, and some of them were quite good.
I am stopping here and I haven't even begun to scratch the surface of why Alternity was good. I am not talking about how skill effected damage, how a better roll meant better damage or how the game handled scaling very well. Without a very good understanding of the basics, none of these would make any sense.
The game was its own system and is very, very good. When I played a Fantasy game based on it last year, I only modified two small things. Otherwise, I used the system as is and the players enjoyed it a lot. So did I!
One reason that I like Alternity so much is because it helped shift the focus from the generic to the specific character. So, instead of being defined by "class" and "race", the character is defined by their background. We referred to character background a LOT when making decisions about the character.
Players got a lot more control over their character's actions, imo. It was much easier to succeed, if you really needed to. This allows a shift from the die rolling to the story telling and what is appropriate for the story by the rules. I like that.
Speaking of the rules, many rules in the GMG were about the story and what the GM wanted to do. If the GM wants a detailed combat system, it is there. If the GM just wants to eye ball it to keep the story moving, that is possible as well.
If Alternity had a more developed "magic" (FX) system, I would probably still be using it. Heck, if it had gotten one revision, which probably would have added what I wanted, I would still be using it. I will still use it as my first choice for Modern or SciFi gaming. For Fantasy, though, I found that Exalted fit my style better, so that's what I am using.
I know I didn't do the system justice but this isn't an easy task to describe a system. Further, some of the things I have learned after playing Alternity for years are tough to show or explain to a person who has just started. For example, Alternity has a much better "alignment" system, which is probably where they got the d20 Modern allegiance idea. It is tough to read this, though, and understand how it all works and fits together.
A good question! Thanks!
Have a good one! Take care!
edg
former Alternity pimp
current Exalted (WW) pimp
Teflon Billy
Explorer
Star Drive was one of the better Sci-fi RPG settings I've ever seen in print.
Breakdaddy
First Post
Teflon Billy said:
Dark Matter was no slouch either.
evildmguy said:
In depth magic rules:
http://www.alternityrpg.net/resources.php?cat=fantasy&rid=83&detail=1
http://www.alternityrpg.net/resources.php?cat=fantasy&rid=225&detail=1
Main fantasy rules:
http://www.alternityrpg.net/resources.php?cat=fantasy&rid=74&detail=1
Red Dragon did a lot of fantasy rules and conversions- just look for his handle in the fantasy menu. I hope he can finish it some day.
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