What's wrong with Stealth?

[Saeviomagy]

A battle breaks out (initiative was just rolled). Rogue, who starts out visible to all, moves behind cover (gaining Total Cover, or Superior Cover, whatever it is called). He then makes a very high Stealth check (beating everyone's Perception checks). Next round, he wants to make a Ranged Sneak Attack. Let's say he does this, and he hits. Would it be Sneak Attack damage?

The NPCs saw where he ran off to, so it's not like they don't have an idea of where he is.

They have an idea, but adventurers "have an idea" that monsters are in a dungeon. That doesn't mean they never get ambushed.

SITUATION 2
(This is probably covered right in the rules)

A battle breaks out (initiative was just rolled). Rogue, who starts out visible to all, moves behind cover (gaining Total Cover, or Superior Cover, whatever it is called). He then makes a very high Stealth check (beating everyone's Perception checks). Next round, he wants to move from his cover to another area of cover 5 squares away. Does the Stealth check allow him to do this w/o being seen during his movement? Even if he is out in the open for a few squares until he gets to the next area of cover?

Nope, he's spotted. UNLESS he has that rogue utility power which specifically allows him to do this (as long as he ends his turn in cover... UNLESS he has the utility power which lets him hide totally out in the open).

Oh, incidentally if there are any monsters who's line of sight to him is still obscured, he's still hidden to those monsters.

 

[Ajar]

Another question on how to rule Stealth...

SITUATION 1

A battle breaks out (initiative was just rolled). Rogue, who starts out visible to all, moves behind cover (gaining Total Cover, or Superior Cover, whatever it is called). He then makes a very high Stealth check (beating everyone's Perception checks). Next round, he wants to make a Ranged Sneak Attack. Let's say he does this, and he hits. Would it be Sneak Attack damage?

The NPCs saw where he ran off to, so it's not like they don't have an idea of where he is.

How does he make a ranged sneak attack from his location if he doesn't have line of sight to any enemies?

The only ways I can think of are:

(1) He does have LoS, but the corners are such that he has retained his superior cover for the whole round since he made his Stealth check, so he can attack without having to move first. In this case, the enemies likely have normal cover against him (-2 to hit).

(2) He can move and attack in a single action, e.g. with Deft Strike.

Otherwise, he loses the hidden status when he steps out from behind cover. He retains its benefits until the end of that move action, but it doesn't help him since he can't attack during the move action.

Saeviomagy answered your other question: he gets spotted. If he ends up in superior cover again, he can make a new Stealth check as normal.

 

[DracoSuave]

How do people generally rule the following:

PC has a Passive Perception of 18. They walk into a room and want to actively check to see if anyone is hiding. They roll lower than their Passive Perception (say they rolled a 13 total). PC argues that his Passive Perception should override their active Perception check because it doesn't make sense that you can spot somone easier when you aren't specifically looking for them (which makes sense). How does one rule?

Anything his 13 would have noticed, he'd have already found with Passive Perception. It's not realistic that suddenly they go blind when they start looking for things actively.

It's just that, nope, don't notice anything on a second look.

PS - I think I answered my own question here on how to rule, but I want to hear other opinions before I throw out my own...

 

[DracoSuave]

How does he make a ranged sneak attack from his location if he doesn't have line of sight to any enemies?

Superior cover and Total concealment do not mean a lack of line of sight. And if he moves after attaining it such that he has only normal cover or concealment, he still retains the hidden status.

 

[Colmarr]

Nope, he's spotted. UNLESS he has that rogue utility power which specifically allows him to do this (as long as he ends his turn in cover... UNLESS he has the utility power which lets him hide totally out in the open).

Is this right?

I'm AFB but I thought the rules specifically stated that you lose stealth at the end of the action that takes you out of cover. So the rogue is stealthed until the end of the move action.

 

[Ajar]

Superior cover and Total concealment do not mean a lack of line of sight.

Yeah, I know. I addressed that in point (1).

And if he moves after attaining it such that he has only normal cover or concealment, he still retains the hidden status.

True. That's a third way that he could move out of his superior cover and still attack with the hidden status on his turn.

 

[Ajar]

Is this right?

I'm AFB but I thought the rules specifically stated that you lose stealth at the end of the action that takes you out of cover. So the rogue is stealthed until the end of the move action.

No, you lose the hidden status immediately, but you retain its benefits (e.g. combat advantage) until the end of the action in which you lost the hidden status.

That's why Shadow Stride (Rogue utility 10) exists.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Is this right?

I'm AFB but I thought the rules specifically stated that you lose stealth at the end of the action that takes you out of cover. So the rogue is stealthed until the end of the move action.

You retain the benefits of being hidden until you complete the action, so:

The rogue moves out of cover. At this point he is still hidden, and any monster who attacks him during this movement has to guess his square and take a penalty to it's attack. At the point where he finishes his movement (even if it's completely out of view), he is no longer stealthed and everyone on the battlefield knows where he is. He could then take another action to hide behind the new cover, but foes still know that's where he was when he began sneaking.

 

[lukelightning]

I'm looking forward to the Martial Power 2 rogue builds... I guess there is one which is super sneaky.

 

[Colmarr]

Stuff

That's what I thought (and how we've been playing it). Thanks