D&D General When the fiction doesn't match the mechanics

[Cadence]

Wow. Really? That’s the direction you want to take?

It's been a long day (COVID and something else in the house). I should have come up with a much better example for the point. I apologize.

 

[Hussar]

I was arguing against the claimed point that in 5e, until you have taken 50% of your hp you don't have a scratch on you. That cannot be true at the very least because of poison, no matter what the rules say.

Also, I have to ask why any version of D&D bothers with damage types at all if nothing connects. What does it matter that you have resistance to fire if the fire attack never hits you? Also, what's the difference between a hit and a miss if nothing connects? Contact of some kind has to be made, and the rules saying otherwise are nonsensical.

Now you’re getting it.

It doesn’t make any sense. We add in the narrative after the fact to make it make sense at the table. But anything the table agrees to is equally valid.

Dumping damage types would be fantastic imo. Damage is damage. End of story.

After all, we’ve done the same for damaging equipment for years. Doesn’t matter what you are damaged by, your equipment is unaffected.

 

[Hussar]

Why does the great axe, or any attack, deal varying amounts of damage at all if nothing connects?

Because we’re playing a game. And variable damage is interesting and fun.

Note that 5e does default to non-variable damage.

 

[Hussar]

I own three or four hardcover adventure paths from the last few editions and I've yet to use any of them in full; and have only used small parts of two of them.

I didn't buy them to run. I bought them to mine for ideas and to provide me maps etc. when I couldn't be arsed to make up my own.

That can be said for just about any work of fiction ever written. Why should RPG books be held to a different standard?

Because they are role playing GAME books. They are serving the game or they are largely pointless. I’ve no issue with fiction - novels and the like- but those are serving a different purpose. They are meant to be read.

A book for a game should be practical for that game.

And while you might not have run those AP’s, are you going to claim that the majority of those buying APs are like you?

I’d say that most people who buy an AP are likely to actually run that AP.

 

[Hussar]

It's been a long day (COVID and something else in the house). I should have come up with a much better example for the point. I apologize.

Dude. No worries. Been there. Hope everyone feels better soon.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Now you’re getting it.

It doesn’t make any sense. We add in the narrative after the fact to make it make sense at the table. But anything the table agrees to is equally valid.

Dumping damage types would be fantastic imo. Damage is damage. End of story.

After all, we’ve done the same for damaging equipment for years. Doesn’t matter what you are damaged by, your equipment is unaffected.

I use rules for damaging equipment.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Because they are role playing GAME books. They are serving the game or they are largely pointless. I’ve no issue with fiction - novels and the like- but those are serving a different purpose. They are meant to be read.

A book for a game should be practical for that game.

And while you might not have run those AP’s, are you going to claim that the majority of those buying APs are like you?

I’d say that most people who buy an AP are likely to actually run that AP.

Are you going to claim that the majority of players hate setting books and wish they didn't exist, like you?

 

[Lanefan]

Now you’re getting it.

It doesn’t make any sense. We add in the narrative after the fact to make it make sense at the table. But anything the table agrees to is equally valid.

Dumping damage types would be fantastic imo. Damage is damage. End of story.

I wouldn't dump them completely but I'd vastly reduce their frequency of use.

Skeletons taking half-damage from piercing, for example, just makes narrative sense (if they instead got an AC bonus against piercing attacks, that'd work fine too...and having just now dreamed up this idea I'm giving it serious thought!) because you're poking or shooting between the bones. Demons, devils, and fiends taking extra damage from holy sources (and angels etc. from unholy) also makes sense.

But every single instance of damage having a type attached? Overkill.

After all, we’ve done the same for damaging equipment for years. Doesn’t matter what you are damaged by, your equipment is unaffected.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of this. Your equipment is exposed to the same fire-acid-cold-etc. that you are and should risk being damaged. 1e has the right of this.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Because I have a group full of 5e players, the same reason as everyone who'd rather play something else.

And where does it say that designers of 5e think realism is the refuge of scoundrels (or words to that effect)? Do you have a statement anywhere from WotC about their design intentions? I know you assume you're right, but I don't.

The 5e designers sure as hell aren't trying for a realistic or detailed game. They know that hit points aren't injury or you wouldn't recover them with eight hours of rest.

They were trying for a medium where there's a little for everyone. Which is entirely incompatible with your assertions about how you can't do things like travel at the speed of plot in a traditional RPG unless you want to arbitrarily declare that D&D no longer qualifies.

I'm sorry that D&D has never been the game you want it to be - and am glad Level Up suits you better. But please stop with the counterfactual statements and gatekeeping about D&D and trad RPGs.

 

[Micah Sweet]

The 5e designers sure as hell aren't trying for a realistic or detailed game. They know that hit points aren't injury or you wouldn't recover them with eight hours of rest.

They were trying for a medium where there's a little for everyone. Which is entirely incompatible with your assertions about how you can't do things like travel at the speed of plot in a traditional RPG unless you want to arbitrarily declare that D&D no longer qualifies.

I'm sorry that D&D has never been the game you want it to be - and am glad Level Up suits you better. But please stop with the counterfactual statements and gatekeeping about D&D and trad RPGs.

I already told you, I meant Classic play, which is what I prefer. You are not playing Classic when you move at the speed of plot.

And please stop accusing me of gatekeeping. I really don't care what you play.