Where is the National Guard?

[Maxperson]

That's the bully's position - you should let me do what I want without objection, and we'll get along fine!

That's not what I'm saying. Our bad behavior, and much of the bombs we drop was not bad behavior, does not excuse theirs. Especially when the 10 up us and start beheading people on video.

Nobody said they were innocent. But let us remember our history: Some bad blood goes back to the Crusades (which were largely European aggression).

I agree.

Much of the modern collection of issues stem back to the displacing of Palestinians without their consent (effectively, again, Western aggression).

The Jerusalem is a Jewish city and the Jews had been displaced from there prior to being restored to their home after WWII.

And when they try to work these things out among themselves in the time-honored form of small wars, we step in to protect our petroleum interests. We topple their governments when we feel like, and then don't do a good job of setting them up to succeed afterwards.

Yes. The U.S. is bad that way and I don't support how we acted.

But *they* aren't innocent, and should stop shooting, and we'd play nice? History doesn't really support that position.

I know. I'm just saying that the current extremist movement (ISIS, Al Shabob (sp) and others) is religious first and foremost, and political second.

 

[Cor Azer]

But I always ask people rabidly in favor of trans rights how they feel about body integrity identity disorder (BIID)? I often find responses illustrative.

Illustrative how?

Because what you seem to be implying is that how someone feels about something that decades of research has shown to not be in any way a psychological disorder should have some sort of bearing on how they feel about a completely unrelated psychological disorder.

 

[Joker]

Okay, I could buy that. It does agree with what I was saying.



That's pretty much exactly what I was saying, though I admit I could have said it better in the first approach.

ETA: the hand-wringing over voter ID is amusing. Voter ID is how they do it in the civilized world (but not America). Just ask a European.

You sure you want to ask someone from a developed European country about how we do it? We also have adult gun regulations to prevent the proliferation of firearms and flooding of the black market. That's how it's done in a civilized country.

 

[Janx]

Back to the original topic...

I notice today that my Google News feed is void of any entries about the Oregon situation.

Mayhap this topic has run its course and the feds will just let them sit there. The media seems to be done with them.

 

[Umbran]

The media seems to be done with them.

North Korea's pretty much stolen their thunder today.

 

[Lord Twig]

I think ignore and wait is the proper response at this point, but I also don't think they should just be able to go home. They should be arrested and charged.

Unarmed protesters are arrested all the time if they are doing something they shouldn't, like blocking roads or whatever. Usually they are just charged with a misdemeanor offence, but that's because they were never a threat to anybody, just a nuisance.

Likewise these guys aren't harming anyone, but they are being a nuisance and it is costing taxpayer dollars to deal with them. They shouldn't be able to just pack up and go home because they have guns. Quite the opposite really.

 

[tuxgeo]

The Bundy militia occupying the federal building in Oregon have been seeking a meeting with the local community to find whether the citizens of Burns and the surrounding ranchers want the militia to be there. That meeting has not happened yet; and there's not much news until it does. I'm guessing that, since the militia were not invited there, they're probably not strongly wanted there; but for the time being, there's no news to report.

At the Bundy ranch in Nevada, those guys were defending their own ranch; but in Oregon, they're taking over federal property. It's not the same situation at all.

 

[Sacrosanct]

A few updates.

A guy who is in the circles of the Central Oregon militia posted a video (don't have the link handy, sorry) a couple days ago where he says he does not support this group because a) the local militia groups were never brought in to get their ideas, b) it was horribly planned, and c) Bundy's group sent out electronic flyers prior saying they would NOT do something like this, and they did, which makes them liars.

There have been children spotted there now, which I'm sure gives the feds reason to not do anything crazy. How did they get there? Why haven't the Feds shut down all traffic to there?

They were supposed to talk with CNN last night, but cancelled at the last minute when they found out the FBI ordered arrest warrants for them.

 

[Umbran]

Why haven't the Feds shut down all traffic to there?

The feds aren't talking much. I would presume it is because these people have not, so far, been seen to be an actual threat to anybody, so whatever their technical infractions, it isn't worth escalating over.

Consider - if they just sit there, in the cold, and nobody pays any attention... well, that's an amazing deflation, now isn't it? Go home, nobody cares.

If they build a cordon around the site, they'll get extra demonstrators and reporters at that cordon. It would increase their news exposure. Who needs that? Keep an eye on them to make sure they aren't hurting anyone, and see if they get bored and go home quietly.

 

[Istbor]

The feds aren't talking much. I would presume it is because these people have not, so far, been seen to be an actual threat to anybody, so whatever their technical infractions, it isn't worth escalating over.

Consider - if they just sit there, in the cold, and nobody pays any attention... well, that's an amazing deflation, now isn't it? Go home, nobody cares.

If they build a cordon around the site, they'll get extra demonstrators and reporters at that cordon. It would increase their news exposure. Who needs that? Keep an eye on them to make sure they aren't hurting anyone, and see if they get bored and go home quietly.

I would go home. Sounds super lame up there. Not to mention it's Oregon. ;D