Why Fighter/Mage?

[Evilhalfling]

Irish mythology was especially fond of the idea of the multi-talented hero. Lugh, for instance, was both a great warrior and a mighty wizard (as well as a poet, blacksmith, etc).

right the Irish! Im thinking there is an indian connection as well, but the hero may have been more god than man, So I am less sure.

Malagigi I had never heard of .. <google> hmm obviously I need to read Bullfinches mythology. (1858)

The break between the hero archtype and roleplaying is frequently about the party of one.
Very few tales have more than one hero, everyone else is a sidekick or helper.

 

[0bsolete]

In the 20th century, and somewhat before, the concept of the hero who is at a disadvantage but manages to use his head to make up for it and thrive is a popular idea. It makes sense looking at the cultural values. Our bodies (as a whole) are on a decline while our minds are getting worked more and more, or left in the dust. So in this century, a strong arm is valued less than a strong mind. With the warrior/mage concept, you have a warrior who can't fight as well as other warriors combined with a mage who can't cast as well as other mages. Intrinsically weak from both sides and unable to compete at all on the battlefields of others choosing. So they fight in a new way, using their minor spell casting abilities to boost them over the fighters and the minor fighting abilities to boost take down the mages. A warrior/mage is just a bit quicker on the uptake, and just a bit more creative and maybe even a bit more insane and a good one, is better than the rest. The appeal is pretty strong.

 

[Urbannen]

I once saw a Western film version of the Mahabharata, one of the important works of Hinduism. I believe some of the characters might be considered fighter/mages. I remember there was some young guy who was fighting on the battle field who suddenly casts a spell (well, he chanted a mantra) that knocks some gook warriors down. It was very Jedi-like - he even looked like Hayden Christiansen (international cast).

 

[Voadam]

I was reading the Fighter/Mage thread, and thought... Fighter/Mages are popular, so popular, people are inventing shorthand to describe them (gish et al.). There is always plenty of discussion regarding how to do a fighter/mage well--somehow, both melee combat and arcane magic together are important.

But I don't see as many discussions regarding other combos. What makes a good Cleric/Ranger? Fighter/Rogue? Just plain Rogue?

Why do we need to combine melee and arcane might in the same package? Why can't it be left to, say, a fighter and a mage?

I play one in a high level recharge magic game. (rgr1/wiz5/hm(v)1/ek9/ac1) It is a lot of fun. It combines two of my favorite things about D&D, chopping into monsters well and using magic. For default vancian magic it does hold the appeal of not having to rely upon your spells entirely in combat and still being mechanically useful after using your days allotment of spells. It is an effective build for a solo game if you can heal as well (one level of ranger for cure light wound wands) though never a really strong build in D&D for large parties where specialization leads to excelling in your niche.

Clerics mechanically handle this niche well but the implied social aspects of running a cleric are not as appealing for me.

Druids handle this mechanically well as well but by default have their own organization baggage whereas warrior mages can be fully free agents and don't have to usually deal with DM views of how their classes should be played.

I'm not really a fan of spell point systems so I haven't tried out the psychic warrior class much.

 

[Mallus]

Hitting power fantasy + blasting/flying/BAMF-ing power fantasy = extra win.

 

[Chimera]

This kind of fantasy (D&D, et al) is described as "Sword and Sorcery".

Fighter/Wizard is BOTH Sword AND Sorcery. Can't get any cooler than that. You not only get to hack down the bad guys with your sword, but blast 'em from a distance with powerful magic.


Beyond that Ideal, I've played a Figher/Rogue (a very cool combination) a Monk/Rogue (also very cool, but needs a lot of gear to make it work well) and a Monk/Wizard (high point build absolutely necessary, but the combination is too gimpy).

One NPC MBEG (Middle Bad Evil Guy) combination that I really enjoyed running was a Ranger/Sorcerer, but that's only a flavor difference from Fighter/Wizard.

 

[SKyOdin]

In the 20th century, and somewhat before, the concept of the hero who is at a disadvantage but manages to use his head to make up for it and thrive is a popular idea. It makes sense looking at the cultural values.

I think you are underestimating the age of that trope. It at least goes back as far as Oedipus and Odysseus. In fact, the hero using his wits to outmaneuver a foe who is more physical or magically powerful is as old as myth itself, in every world culture.

 

[Roland55]

Can't believe I'm first to mention the Finns...

Check out their mythic cycle. You'll find this 'mix' is very important.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Why do we need to combine melee and arcane might in the same package?

Besides the roots of the game and the charactesr mentioned above...

The Kalevala is full of characters who blend the various D&D classes, especially in the sense of being powerful warriors and mages.

In Native American mythology, you find the mix of battle prowess and arcane knowledge is pretty common in the major heroes.

Besides Elric, most of the incarnations of Michael Moorcock's Eternal Champion are some mix of the swordsman and sorcerer.

Lythande and several characters of the Thieves' World stories and novels mix the two.

And, for the record, I agree that it is in part the aspect of the seemingly diametrically opposed nature of the two skillsets that makes those characters so compelling. To be even competent at one takes a lot of time, to be competent in both seems freakishly difficult.

Its like meeting someone who is both a highly-acclaimed pro athelete and a respected MD, or a modern "Rennaisance Man."

 

[Evilhalfling]

Malagigi from the medieval Legends of Charlemagne is a wizard-knight, and probably the archetypal one for the Western world.

Thanks Clavis, picked up a copy of the legends of Charlemagne - its just lovely.
so far Malagigi has had his book stolen by a woman with an invisibility ring, and been sealed in a rock under the sea by his own stolen spells.
Charlemagne's Peers included a archbishop, a barbarian (dane) and this knight/enchanter.
but 12 is a little large for an adventuring party.