Why won't you switch?

[AllisterH]

re: Rolled HP

Um, I think math comes to the rescue before we fight

Using Statistics, you can show that the effect of rolled HP will not differentiate much from the effect of simply average the die as you increase the number of times the die is rolled.

Basically, as the number of rolls goes up, the std deviation will shrink (you get closer to the average) and what many people remember as wildly differing HP totals for characters of the same class was the effect of CON being added.

This was ironically more noticeable in the lower die classes like the d4 and the d6.

Ex: A wizard from levels 2-11 will gain an average of 25 hp, however, the difference in CON gain of say a 12 CON and 16 CON is 20 HP. The std deviation is SIGNIFICANLY smaller. The CON basically overwrites any effect from the rolling of a die.

 

[Delta]

Basically, as the number of rolls goes up, the std deviation will shrink (you get closer to the average) and what many people remember as wildly differing HP totals for characters of the same class was the effect of CON being added... The std deviation is SIGNIFICANLY smaller.

Actually, what's correct to say is that the standard deviation goes down as a proportion of the mean. The standard deviation itself actually goes up in this situation.

1d6 ~ mean 3.5, stdev 1.71
2d6 ~ mean 7.0, stdev 2.42
3d6 ~ mean 10.5, stdev 2.96
Etc.

 

[AllisterH]

Actually, what's correct to say is that the standard deviation goes down as a proportion of the mean. The standard deviation itself actually goes up in this situation.

1d6 ~ mean 3.5, stdev 1.71
2d6 ~ mean 7.0, stdev 2.42
3d6 ~ mean 10.5, stdev 2.96
Etc.

(Math geek's hat on)
Hmm?

That doesn't sound right at all.
Variance of a single X-sided die = (X^2-1)/12
Variance of the sum of z X-sided dice = z*(X^2-1)/12
Std deviation is the square root of that.

Hmm...You're right. My math-fu has grown weak over the years (holds head in shame and throws math geek hat into trash )

 

[Arnwyn]

Sorry, that's a bit snarky.

Indeed - especially in a thread in which you could be considered threadcrapping.

Randomness in play is fun; randomness in character creation and advancement is not.

I hope you're not trying to say that somebody's preference is wrong. Especially in this particular thread (see above).

 

[Desdichado]

I hope you're not trying to say that somebody's preference is wrong. Especially in this particular thread (see above).

I think he's just saying that he thinks that randomness in play is fun; randomness in character creation and advancement is not.

I happen to agree.

 

[malladin]

For me its that I get the sense that 4th ed will have a specific identity rather than the tool kit approach of 3rd, not a bad thing but not what i'm looking for. Further, there are plenty of other games that fulfil the role 4th seems o be aiming at that i'm already playing so it'd just a wasted invested, especially when i'm trying to cut down on buying new stuff(damn you Dark Heresey )

 

[Betote]

The skill system revealed in the Rogue sneak peek, being the same as the one used in True20 or SWSE, is what kills the game for me. I moved to 3.X because of its skill ranks allocating system and the PCs being equally treated as NPCs/monsters, and if they're taking these features away, I'm afraid I'm out of the wagon.

That makes 4E a game I'd maybe use for one-shots if the published adventures are of good quality, but never a system of choose when I'm going to DM a campaign.

 

[Nellisir]

The skill system revealed in the Rogue sneak peek, being the same as the one used in True20 or SWSE, is what kills the game for me.

You can allocate skill ranks in True20 just like D&D. Blue Rose had an "automatic" skill system, but they switched back to standard skill points for True20.

 

[Arnwyn]

I think he's just saying that he thinks that randomness in play is fun; randomness in character creation and advancement is not.

Oh. He must have made an error in quoting, then. And forgot the "for me" (never implied on an internet messageboard, sadly, especially when the quoting mechanism is used).

 

[Mortellan]

For me its that I get the sense that 4th ed will have a specific identity rather than the tool kit approach of 3rd, not a bad thing but not what i'm looking for. Further, there are plenty of other games that fulfil the role 4th seems o be aiming at that i'm already playing so it'd just a wasted invested, especially when i'm trying to cut down on buying new stuff(damn you Dark Heresey )

That's how me and my friends are beginning to feel. Dark Heresy is something we've waited years for someone to make, versus an unproven, overly hyped and possibly unnecessary game edition.