D&D 4E Women in 4E

[Lonely Tylenol]

To be fair, women who already play D&D wouldn't have a problem with it. If they did have a problem with it, they wouldn't play.

That's a bit of a false dichotomy. Even if they have a bit of a problem with it, there's no reason why they wouldn't play anyway. Not everyone is a radical political activist who bases all their decisions on the political ramifications of their actions.

It's a bit like the way some economists say that purchases are a manifestation of the free choice of the consumer. It's a load of bull. It's not a free choice if there are limited choices. Sometimes you do things that you like that also have drawbacks attached to them, because you're drawing from a limited pool of options. As far as I can tell, WotC is one of the better companies as far as titillating art is concerned, so if you were looking for an RPG, and turned off by that sort of art, D&D is a preferred option.

edit:

Um. Hi. I'm a woman who plays D&D and does have a problem with it. Nice to meet you.

There you go.

One potential suggestion is that the presence of hyper-sexualized female art contributes to that stigma. Saying "all my female/male players are fine with it" does not help, because they do not hold that stigma. They are players, after all.

It's a bit self-selecting, yes. But someone's also mentioned that what we have here is anecdotal evidence "I know a woman who hates this stuff" versus anecodotal evidence "I know a woman who doesn't." So we're hardly going to get statistically sound demographics anyway.

 

[Doc_Klueless]

Thus:
www.millglen.org/c/mgs/Upload/womens_club/wilma-betty.jpg

That picture is obviously meant to titillate! Did you see all the skin?

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

I have two friends who both have doctorates in Victorian Literature and Culture - the chair leg skirt thing is a myth! Victorian society wasn't 'repressed' - it expressed sexual desire in a different way. We consider it 'repressed' because of chronological snobbery and the fact that we're presented with sexualised imagery on a daily basis.

See, that's what I thought. Thank you for clearing that up.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

So, you're saying that female barbarians should pluck their eyebrows?
Also, she shows midriff, therefore it's porn. Shame on you.

 

[Clavis]

Here's a question

What should a female barbarian look like?

Something like this?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dianayorkblaine/353975121/

When it comes to things like what a female barbarian (tribeswoman) would look like, or what armor for females would look like, there are real-world examples for us to look at. Female tribesman, for instance, tend NOT to be particularly muscular-looking by modern standards. The funny thing about the modern "athletic" body type (with large muscles) is that is isn't common in people who live in a state of nature, and particularly not in women who live in that state.

Conan, for instance, if the Cimmerians were real, would not have looked the way Howard described him and artists have painted him. He would be muscular and lean, but not particularly large by body-builder standards.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

Or like that?

Look at all that skin being flashed around..okay, it's a greek illustration, they knew what drew the glances.

 

[SteveC]

And I've said it before and I'LL say it again.

Comparing the cover art for D&D with the cover art for romance novels and women's beauty and sex magazines just makes you look foolish. They are entirely different contexts.

Really? That's interesting. Care to say why, exactly? Have you ever read one of them? I have (again, this was as a quid pro quo for introducing an old girlfriend to gaming) and there is a lot of similarity.

Let me ask this: do you actually have any background and experience for selling or marketing any products towards women at all? If so, please share your insight...if not, why not leave things to the folks at WotC who spend a lot of money researching these things?

I'll say this again...women!=prudes, any more than men are. Let's not market to them as if they are, because, it just makes gamers look like we know even less about women than we do.

--Steve

 

[Aloïsius]

Something like this?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dianayorkblaine/353975121/

That's silly and unrealistic : look all the skin ! If she were really living in Bora, that would leave her flesh exposed to the bite of mosquito...

 

[Klaus]

So, you're saying that female barbarians should pluck their eyebrows?

Oh, please, God, yes!

Also, she shows midriff, therefore it's porn. Shame on you.

Hey, I'm not turning down Lux the Barbarian porn.

 

[Geron Raveneye]

That's silly and unrealistic : look all the skin ! If she were really living in Bora, that would leave her flesh exposed to the bite of mosquito...

...which translates to stirge bites in D&D. Yep, I totally agree, can't have that kind of costume there!