Changeover Poll

[Imaro]

I am not sure what it is like in other countries, but in the USA, just having a bank account gives you a debit card with a VISA or Mastercard compatibility. And yes, parents/family can still buy a DDI account for a child without a bank account.

Uhmm.. ok I'm not sure I get your point...I addressed a certain group of people (those without access for some reason or another), are you telling me everyone in the US, (and yes I live in the US) has a credit card or every child's parent in the US wants to put an online subscription on their card for their child. I think many parents would feel more comfortable giving the child the money to buy a magazine than signing into an online subscription that auto-renews and that's hard to cancel. As a parent I know I wouldn't let my son use my card for something like that, but we go into the comic store and I'll purchase the comics he wants You see I never said there weren't people who had access... but you seem to be trying to paint the broad stroke that everyone (at least in the US) does. Plain and simple.. That's just incorrect.

 

[catsclaw227]

The print magazines helped make me feel like I was part of a community. Not only were there fluff and crunch articles, there were advertisements, book reviews, comics, new book releases (not all from WOTC), and fiction. While the fluff and crunch articles were the bread and butter of the magazines, the other information added depth. I read "Order of the Stick" every time it comes out but I don't get the same feeling that I did when I read it in the magazine when it was part of something greater. For me there is no Gestalt feeling when I go to four different websites to get the same stuff that I got in one magazine. Knights of the Dinner Table is more useful to me than the Dragon/Dungeon PDFs for these reasons.

I confess that I like the tactile feel of magazines and comics in hands, but the PDFs do not offer everything that I got from the dead tree versions, like the WOW factor of seeing a cool advert for something new.

I can appreciate and respect this opinion.

For me, though, I get more community from being online than by reading a magazine in private. The Scale Mail letters were no different than a few posts on topic on a typical message board, and in the past 4-6 years, any advertisements I was interested in were already "old" because I knew about the product from being online. The small business ads were kinda neat, but really just something to skim and smile once in a while. I get that far more often online, and I can get a more varied set of articles/blogs/etc.

I want Dungeon and Dragon for the utility it provides for me, in game. Maybe this is where I differ from other posters in this thread. I get my community from EnWorld and other forums/sites/blogs. I want my Dungeon and Dragon to be my game aids.

 

[catsclaw227]

I am not sure what it is like in other countries, but in the USA, just having a bank account gives you a debit card with a VISA or Mastercard compatibility. And yes, parents/family can still buy a DDI account for a child without a bank account.

Uhmm.. ok I'm not sure I get your point...I addressed a certain group of people (those without access for some reason or another), are you telling me everyone in the US, (and yes I live in the US) has a credit card or every child's parent in the US wants to put an online subscription on their card for their child. I think many parents would feel more comfortable giving the child the money to buy a magazine than signing into an online subscription that auto-renews and that's hard to cancel. As a parent I know I wouldn't let my son use my card for something like that, but we go into the comic store and I'll purchase the comics he wants You see I never said there weren't people who had access... but you seem to be trying to paint the broad stroke that everyone (at least in the US) does. Plain and simple.. That's just incorrect.

I didn't paint any broad strokes, nor did I state that everyone in the US has a credit card. I was simply pointing out that, in this day and age, the ability to buy online is extremely accessible. Do you disagree with this notion?

As a parent, I would prefer to go online and buy my kid an online subscription. That is my preference. I am not claiming that is another parent's preference.

And, just to make it clear, it is NOT hard to cancel the auto-renew. If you got to WOTC's site or read any of the posts where the difficulty of canceling is brought up, you can find plenty of links posted all over that say how to do it, and it takes all of about 5 minutes of effort, MAX. It's easier to cancel your autorenew than to take back an article of clothing from Old Navy for a different size, and that is really easy to do.

 

[Imaro]

I didn't paint any broad strokes, nor did I state that everyone in the US has a credit card. I was simply pointing out that, in this day and age, the ability to buy online is extremely accessible. Do you disagree with this notion?

As a parent, I would prefer to go online and buy my kid an online subscription. That is my preference. I am not claiming that is another parent's preference.

And, just to make it clear, it is NOT hard to cancel the auto-renew. If you got to WOTC's site or read any of the posts where the difficulty of canceling is brought up, you can find plenty of links posted all over that say how to do it, and it takes all of about 5 minutes of effort, MAX. It's easier to cancel your autorenew than to take back an article of clothing from Old Navy for a different size, and that is really easy to do.

Then... once again, I still don't understand what the point of you quoting my statement and the reply you posted. I never said no one could access online buying, I simply stated for those who cannot, the physical form and it's availability were a defining characteristic. Do you agree with this or not?

Perhaps I'm looking for a connection, since you quoted me and made general statements, yet now are stating what is your preference, and I never commented on your preference so your posts are confusing me slightly.

As far as how easy or hard it is to cancel... plenty of posters on WotC boards who have subscribed ... would disagree with you . I wouldn't know personally but the number of complaints on their boards, and the answers received make me skeptical of the validity of your statement. YMMV of course. Have you cancelled your subscription? And if not, how do you know how hard or easy it is?

 

[Edena_of_Neith]

Hey, we've beaten 1,100 votes, in this poll.

No change in the results, as usual, but that vote count continues to rise.

With this kind of interest in the Hobby, it sure as heck is going to continue! : )

 

[Jasperak]

I can appreciate and respect this opinion.

For me, though, I get more community from being online than by reading a magazine in private. The Scale Mail letters were no different than a few posts on topic on a typical message board, and in the past 4-6 years, any advertisements I was interested in were already "old" because I knew about the product from being online. The small business ads were kinda neat, but really just something to skim and smile once in a while. I get that far more often online, and I can get a more varied set of articles/blogs/etc.

I want Dungeon and Dragon for the utility it provides for me, in game. Maybe this is where I differ from other posters in this thread. I get my community from EnWorld and other forums/sites/blogs. I want my Dungeon and Dragon to be my game aids.

I was sure when I made the original post that I was not articulating my feelings about WOTC's e-zines v. print Dungeon & Dragon properly. Truthfully I don't think I care enough to type a long essay about my feelings, but I will try and make a few points.

Your thoughts about the e-zines are different from mine and I respect that, but what's done is done. WOTC took away something that got me into my FLGS twice a month; you know the place where you can meet gamers face-to-face. My FLGS also stopped carrying Knights of the Dinner Table, so I now have no motivation to go to my FLGS. Nothing to look forward to. No face-to-face community. Right now my only link to the RPG community is online and well, why bother. I am having more fun right now with Guild Wars than any edition of D&D.

There just seems something so wrong with a hobby that is designed for face-to-face play but only gets support online. I can order my books online for less than B&M stores. I can only get my monthly gaming aids online now. The RPGA sucks badly in my area and forces you to play an edition I don't like.

I know I sound like a big crybaby, but I am starting to question why I even bother. This all started when they shut down the print mags I have known for 20+ years.

 

[Aus_Snow]

The print magazines helped make me feel like I was part of a community. Not only were there fluff and crunch articles, there were advertisements, book reviews, comics, new book releases (not all from WOTC), and fiction.

Hells, yes [emphasis mine]. Several people I know used to find out about third party books this way, for the most part. They might never have discovered a number of inestimably useful items, if not for Dragon and Dungeon print magazines.

My favourite bit of anecdotal 'evidence' (really, more an account than evidence of anything that springs to mind, mind you) is that I used to find Dragon and Dungeon magazines in places like a tiny newsagent, in a tiny seaside village, over the other side of the world from the USA. Regularly.

Magazine, not magazine, whatever. They are a totally different beast now, in numerous ways. Personally, I still think it's a shame that things went this way. And a mistake, what's more. But time will tell.

I'm sorry for not articulating my thoughts as clearly as I would like

No need, and it seemed clear enough to me. In that order.

 

[cildarith]

If I can't read it on a bus (don't own a laptop), or more importantly, in the WC (any other parents out there will probably confirm that the only moments of privacy you get from a toddler is whilst pondering on the porcelain....and sometimes not even then ) it's not a magazine....you can call it an e-zine and pretend that all of the tactile/sensory stimuli that are attendant with flipping through a real book or magazine, but brother, from where I'm sitting, if it's not printed on dead trees and mailed to my mailbox where I can gleefully anticipate its arrival, then it truly isn't a magazine.

From my perspective (and did I mention how much I LOATHE reading PDFs?!?!) Dragon and Dungeon are deader than the creatures of the Burgess Shale. Content is meaningless for me if I can't read it (and as I don't read PDF's with anything even remotely resembling pleasure.... .......) so thus, I concur with the above opinion that for all intents and purposes (for me, and I certainly don't intend to speak for everybody else on the planet) those great instituions of gaming are finis.

YMMV, IMNSHO, etc. etc.

Cheers,
Colin

Well, you speak pretty well for me. The lack of in print magazines is a fairly significant part of the reason I have very little interest in 4E. The "magazines" may not be dead and gone, but they are to me (and D&D along with it).

 

[joethelawyer]

Well, you speak pretty well for me. The lack of in print magazines is a fairly significant part of the reason I have very little interest in 4E. The "magazines" may not be dead and gone, but they are to me (and D&D along with it).

I have some hopes for Kobold Quarterly become what Dragon used to be, but I think they are still deciding if it will support 4e, 3e, some combination of the above, or whatever. Anyone hear any news on that front, BTW?

 

[Jasperak]

I have some hopes for Kobold Quarterly become what Dragon used to be, but I think they are still deciding if it will support 4e, 3e, some combination of the above, or whatever. Anyone hear any news on that front, BTW?

I hope they support both editions and their derivatives as much as possible.