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Help getting old 2nd player to DM for 8 and 10 year old daughters

That might explain it. How often should players really need healing and rest? So far the group is nice and "varied" with a Ranger, Fighter, Paladin and Sword Mage.
Normally it would be 5 strikers and a wizard... The idea that 1 hit could very nearly explode one of the players I found odd.
Its more like I could accept 2d8 or so but something like 1d4+6.. the bonus was higher than the dam roll. I tend to enjoy bigger gaps between min and max rolls. Whereas I see this just tries to raise the average damage.
And yes, when I would play Id be optimized to hell with everything researched and referenced. Only the ranger has a ranged weapon, even though opted 2 weapon style.
I told the rest get some damn daggers or something.
Also I saw the old character builder does have something like a 1d4 unarmed ranged attack. Is this supposed to be just grabbing environment/rocks or some such and tossing it?
 

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Just a few comments from what you said:

- The 'standard' party size is 5, and published scenarios are written for that, so if you are running combat encounters as written they might well be a bit tough for a party of 4.

- The party has no 'leader' character (cleric, bard, warlord); that isn't a big problem (I run for a party of 7 that doesn't have one), but bear in mind that they will be lower on in-combat healing than a party that has one.

- A short rest after every encounter is normal. Remember that a character actually has (4 + number of healing surges) times one quarter of their hit points that they can take in damage per day (i.e. before an extended rest). 4E characters are pretty tough unless you either overwhelm them in one combat or push them very hard over the "day".

- You might need to remind the players about Second Wind. At lower levels it can be extremely handy.

- There is an "improvised weapon" option for Ranged Basic attacks, I think, yeah. Search under "improvised weapons".
 

I know, there's never a leader. Hence someone decided to go Paladin because he can heal.
Although not as great, surprise.
My wife went Fighter at first but may switch Psion since the younger kid isn't apparently playing so no 2x controllers and no defenders like it was looking before.
I wasn't sure how many the party was intended to be.
I know it said 5 players but being as basic as it is I didnt put it past them to count the DM as well.

We weren't using real power cards, just my notes on the skills on a sheet of paper.
I plan to print them out today at work. Got some nice Xerox Colorqube printers here. I printed the keep on shadow fell and it looks retail. I'm having someone show me how to use the binding feature later ;)

How good is the D&D insider? I managed to find a bunch of pdf's and was thinking of trying to make my own pdfs like one referencing all Ranger materials, 1 for Paladins, etc for everyone. But not sure if that's just too much work for pointlessness. I did like the older character builder since it would reference everything for you so I could double check.
 

2 kids and Wife finished introduction. My bro in law and friend opted to join at the DM guide/2nd part portion. Youngest kid wasn't interested. 1 less, not too bad.
Is it me or do some of these monsters do some insane damage?
According to Red Box rules, Gray Wolves get +7 v AC, 1d6+5 and free shift 4 squares. Monster Manual is still +7 v AC, but only 1d6+2. Not +5, no free shifting around.
Thats one example. A few others had just some very off damages. I got to the point I had to just fudge attacks to not murder everyone out of the gate.

Hmmmmmm. Well, the original MM1 monsters simply proved to be underpowered. Low level monsters were often OK, but you'd find pretty quickly as levels go up that many monsters just became bricks, and DMs had to use level+5 or more monsters just to get out some damage and be a threat, which are then hard to hit, had lots more hit points, etc. Starting with MM3 WotC revised the standards for damage output and some other numbers, reduced hit points for solos somewhat, etc. The result is what you see. An MM1 wolf might do 1d6+2, which is an average of 5.5 damage per hit. The MM3/MV version does 1d6+5, which is 8.5 per hit. The standard is now level+8 average damage per hit. Monsters with the Brute role do between 25 and 40% more, and 'limited' attacks (IE recharge/encounter attacks) generally do about 50% more damage than at-wills. This is all somewhat subjective of course, a limited attack with a wide area of effect (like an Area 3 at 10 squares say) probably won't have boosted damage because it will likely hit several PCs at once. In any case ideally level+8 is the baseline, though a few low level monsters do less.

It has been noted that, especially at low level, there are a few monsters that even though they follow the guidelines are extra deadly. Most of those have been revised either with errata or by republishing in MV with modified stats. You're always well-advised to use the newest iteration of any monster you can find, they generally work better.

As for ultra-deadliness.... Hmmmmm, not sure why you say that. Your average wizard (about the lowest hit point class) has Constitution plus 10 hit points. This means the minimum is 18 at level 1, and 4 more/level thereafter. So, your average wizard can stand up to 2-3 wolf bites, and probably more considering Second Wind and leader healing if things get bad. Generally if the wolf is chewing on the wizard for the 4+ rounds needed to finish him off something went badly wrong!

Remember too, said 8 CON 18 hit point wizard has 5 healing surges, worth 4 hit points each. Even if he gets gnawed to an inch of his life and has no cleric around he can recover all 18 hit points in a short rest (though he'll be left with no more surges). Most players will choose to start with a 10 or a 12 CON, so in reality even a wizard would typically have 6-7 surges and start with 20-22 hit points (surge value 5), so a 12 CON wizard has 22 hit points, 7 surges, and each is worth 5 points, so he can completely recover all his hit points, plus about 50%, being able to absorb 57 damage over a whole day in theory. In practice most of his healing will have leader bonuses, which for clerics are often something like 6 or more points, meaning our redoubtable 12 CON wizard will probably survive a day where he takes 80 damage total! 22 points delivered rapidly in a bad situation can still kill him quite easily, but you will find that most groups are pretty tough and can take a couple of fairly stiff hits without it being a crisis.

A fighter starts with 15 + CON, and usually CON is a higher priority, so 30+ hit points are not unusual at level 1, with 10+ surges, each worth 7, maybe even 8 points. Obviously fighters get chewed on a lot, but again, its going to take 3-4 wolf bites to even make him sweat.
 

I know, there's never a leader. Hence someone decided to go Paladin because he can heal.
Although not as great, surprise.
My wife went Fighter at first but may switch Psion since the younger kid isn't apparently playing so no 2x controllers and no defenders like it was looking before.
I wasn't sure how many the party was intended to be.
I know it said 5 players but being as basic as it is I didnt put it past them to count the DM as well.

We weren't using real power cards, just my notes on the skills on a sheet of paper.
I plan to print them out today at work. Got some nice Xerox Colorqube printers here. I printed the keep on shadow fell and it looks retail. I'm having someone show me how to use the binding feature later ;)

How good is the D&D insider? I managed to find a bunch of pdf's and was thinking of trying to make my own pdfs like one referencing all Ranger materials, 1 for Paladins, etc for everyone. But not sure if that's just too much work for pointlessness. I did like the older character builder since it would reference everything for you so I could double check.

DDI is great! http://www.wizards.com/dndinsider/compendium/database.aspx is the online Compendium (it will let you search without a DDI account, but it won't let you view the details of an entry, even so you can see what book to look stuff up in). I think the Compendium alone is by far the most useful part of DDI, and worth the cost. I can look up any monster and its simple to just past stat blocks to a file (I just screen cap them and slap them into a page using GIMP) print it out, and you have all you need without page flipping. More recently I just bring an iPad to the game and put each one on a tab in the browser. The Character Builder is highly useful too, though I have to say the online CB can be a pain to use (it gets slow and crashes sometimes). Dragon and Dungeon are pretty nice and there are a vast number of cool articles and etc you can download from the last 5 years. You can get a 1 month sub for $10 and check it out, low risk and even if you stop using it you can keep all the PDFs you will ever need.

As others have said, the idealized party is 5 chars, 2 strikers, 1 defender, 1 leader, and 1 controller. Controllers are somewhat less often used than the others, so you often see 3 strikers, a defender, and a leader, or 2 strikers and 2 defenders. Fighters are your common defender and they do basically low striker level damage, so striker/defender can be fairly interchangeable. Going without ANY defenders can be tricky, but a tough barbarian, monk, or beast master ranger can do the job of pinning things down. You can likewise live without a leader. The idea there being the extra striker just kills stuff faster and less healing is needed. I have a party with 5 strikers right now, and it works pretty well (they do love healing potions though, lol).

You COULD always reduce the encounters by one monster if you have 4 players. Chances are players that focus fire and play tactics will do fine, but that might not describe your players! You can always replace a regular monster with a minion too, minions are fun.
 

What's the stance on D&D Next/5th?
I gave that a look and it seems to be a bit more like a mix of 3.5 and 4.
The thing with 4 is I didn't like the idea of only having a few skills on hand, and having to pick through a bunch.
Is it worth going down to 3.5?
How different are the 3.0 DM and MM guides? Decent amount of modules still available?
As it stands I'm not comfortable doing my own stuff and rather follow some modules for a bit.
 

Looks like I'm in trouble. My 10 year old wont leave me alone and wants to play bad.
Are there any premades or something for just 1 or 2 players?
 


Modules: There are a few.
My advice is to take the old Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh 1st ed module, and convert it to 4th.

Editions... so many questions there. What is the stance? people whined on the net that they didn't/don't like 4th, so much so that Hasbro listened to them over the people who countered their arguments and DID like the new system. Piazo made Pathfinder based (as I understand it) 95% on 3rd and 3.5. 5e/Next is in development, trying to be both 3.5 and 4 at the same time. Lots and lots of flame-war posts on the WotC boards. Kinda sad, really
Is DDI worth it? Opinions divided. Maybe for a month or so--that way you can get all the content and download it. Sadly, a lot of the content gets bulky and cumbersome.

Pretty Assassin? Sure.
Funny thing--almost off topic: Of all the assassin classes, the best one I've seen was in Ultramodern. Made perfect sense. Worked. Clean, efficient, and simple to understand. Obviously not a Hasbro/WotC product. But it, sadly, is not necessarily going to fit in with regular D&D without some adaptation (Ultramodern is build with the assumption of no magic equipment). The Ultramodern martial artist was also way better than the silly Psionic monk.
 

Hence my confusion. When I was first seeing the 4th powers and what not, I couldn't help but think of it being aimed at MMO players. I read essentials and it seems just simplified character creation/progression. I can see for some thing being good, as with all these source materials, picking Feats can be daunting. Myself personal like minmaxing and variety.
I had played some 1st when I was a wee tot but majority was 2nd edition, as well as Baldur's Gate on PC, and other 2nd ed ruleset games.

I gave a quick glance over the D&D Next and I dunno how that's going to fly.

So for 4e vs essentials, From what I can tell they redid some rules, monsters and the characters generation.
So is it correct that the rules and monsters are the more up to date and favored option where as for characters the PHB gives more variety as opposed to essentials static progression?
 

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