D&D 5E Sorcerer vs. Wizard: Anything You Can Do I Can Do Better?

[Ashrym]

Wizards still have more spells known, so they do have more leeway to cover edge cases, but mostly its their ritual magic, rivalled only by tomelocks, that lets them cover these "what if" scenarios. And if they really know they're going to need a certain edge spell, they can go out and get it, which is not an option for sorcerers. Sorcerers get pigeonholed into picking the best, and only the absolute best, spells they can get. The sorcerer's already pruned spell list might as well be cut in half, because many simply aren't good enough to even consider, while a wizard might chance upon them, copy them into the spellbook and choose to prepare them on a special occasion.

A sorcerer, or any other character, can pick up ritual caster as a feat and use skills instead of spells. 3 out 4 sorcerers fly without the concentration restriction while acquiring a flying mount is an alternative to spells if climbing isn't an option.

Many of the previously mentioned spells are available to sorcerers and among several classes as well. A group can coordinate to optimize functions if the group carries a sorcerer instead of a wizard. Gate, for example, could be taken by the sorcerer but could be prepared by the cleric if needed.

Spell preparation is a good ability and so is the wizard ritual casting but I would take a sorcerer in a social pillar or combat situation because of a better casting stat synergy and more punch to the spell slots. It works for me.

I voted 3...

Their spell lists overlap a lot. They both are full casters.

The big difference is flexibility in how they cast vs flexibility in what they cast.

The sorcerer can silence a spell, or twin one, or any of the other metamagics. But he knows only a small subset of spells off the class list at all, and cannot pick up new ones except by level-up. He also doesn't need books to swap amongst that subset. They have a limited ability to recharge spells on the fly at best, 14 spell levels worth (20th level, 2x5th +1x4th or 2x5th + 2x24th).

The Wizard can cast ANY spell he/she/it can find in a written form, at least, given time to study it. They are the only class that doesn't "know" spells. They have an external "knowledge" - the spell books they own. Note the plural - wizards can gain a lot of flexibility by KTAATTS-ing other wizards. Whatever is in their books, they can have ready in the morning. THis is a VERY wide potential. Likewise, they can pay to add new spells. Plus, the ability to recover slots is better than that of the sorcerer, but it's a fixed and dedicated feature - it only recovers spell slots, and it cannot be used to do other metamagic stuff; the peak is in fact 20 levels worth of spells, and can recover up to 6th level slots, for a peak of 3x6th +1x2 at 20th level. It takes longer, but is more potent and more flexible than Sorcerous conversion of SP to slots.

So, a 5th level sorcerer knows 6 spells total, plus 5 cantrips. And can prepare 5+ChaMod spells. He's NEVER going to limit out unless he's got a Charisma below 10. You can change out spells at level-up - but ONLY at level up. (Barring Adv League play.)
The 5th level wizard has at least 10 spells, and can only memorize 5+IntMod of them By level 5, he's almost always got more spells in his books than he can have readied. And, given a long rest + a few minutes, you can swap any of the prepared ones out for a different one from your books. And you can add more from scrolls or from captured spellbooks.

That all said, the better proficiencies of the Sorcerer put it a bit over the top for me. But just a bit. Not nearly so munchkin as the Tiefling Blade Pact of the Old Ones Warlock...

Wizards only recover 1/2 half levels of spells rounded up to a maximum of 5th level spells. Sorcery points provide more with no need for a rest and the option to manipulate spells for a better mechanic.

For example, a 20th level wizard can rest to recover spent slots for a maximum of 10 levels worth of spells and would be 7 spells at the most with 4 1st-level spells and 3 2nd-level spells. Sorcery points could do that and either have 3 points left over to meta or create more slots than the wizard recovers.

 

[Coredump]

Current metamagic choices are pretty lame as it is, with only a handful shining. We do need more options, but increasing number of metamagic options known without more options at this point is kinda silly.

I disagree... a lot of the metamagic is very niche. There are situations where it could be very useful, but not often enough to take them; because you get so few.

 

[Coredump]

More metamagic options would be welcome, I was suprirsed we didn't see anything like energy admixture out of the box, but beyond that what else? Non-lethal spell? Dual spell(two in the same casting)? something to negate legendary resistance? I don't know

I don't mean more metamagic options, I mean they should 'know' more metamagic options. Instead of picking 2, they can pick 3 or 4. Or maybe some mechanic where they can pick the 2 they can use each morning.

 

[MoonSong]

I don't mean more metamagic options, I mean they should 'know' more metamagic options. Instead of picking 2, they can pick 3 or 4. Or maybe some mechanic where they can pick the 2 they can use each morning.

Ew that's so vancian... the only thing a sorcerer prepares are her meals.

 

[Mephista]

I don't mean more metamagic options, I mean they should 'know' more metamagic options. Instead of picking 2, they can pick 3 or 4. Or maybe some mechanic where they can pick the 2 they can use each morning.

I'm of the opinion that would be a bad move. I personally don't want the ability to effectively pick all the good metamagic options at once. I personally feel that these choices should be meaningful, and help differentiate various sorcerer builds.

If you can get all the good ones at once, it'll make the sorcerers all start to feel more same-y. This way, you've got more of a spread and focus on the type of magic you specialize in.

 

[Dragonsbane]

Um . . a wizard can change his spells every day? I thought that was the major difference/perk for wizards, versatility. Just sayin.

 

[aramis erak]

A sorcerer, or any other character, can pick up ritual caster as a feat and use skills instead of spells. 3 out 4 sorcerers fly without the concentration restriction while acquiring a flying mount is an alternative to spells if climbing isn't an option.

Many of the previously mentioned spells are available to sorcerers and among several classes as well. A group can coordinate to optimize functions if the group carries a sorcerer instead of a wizard. Gate, for example, could be taken by the sorcerer but could be prepared by the cleric if needed.

Spell preparation is a good ability and so is the wizard ritual casting but I would take a sorcerer in a social pillar or combat situation because of a better casting stat synergy and more punch to the spell slots. It works for me.





Wizards only recover 1/2 half levels of spells rounded up to a maximum of 5th level spells. Sorcery points provide more with no need for a rest and the option to manipulate spells for a better mechanic.

For example, a 20th level wizard can rest to recover spent slots for a maximum of 10 levels worth of spells and would be 7 spells at the most with 4 1st-level spells and 3 2nd-level spells. Sorcery points could do that and either have 3 points left over to meta or create more slots than the wizard recovers.

We were Both wrong. Half level of spells to maximum of 6th level for wizards.

If you're going to correct me, at least be correct yourself. I'll admit when I'm wrong...

 

[Ashrym]

We were Both wrong. Half level of spells to maximum of 6th level for wizards.

If you're going to correct me, at least be correct yourself. I'll admit when I'm wrong...

I do not believe that I am not wrong. PHB pg 115...

"The spell slots can have a combined level that is equal to or less than half your wizard level (rounded up), and none of the slots can be 6th level or higher."

Do you have a reference I may have missed?