D&D (2024) Sacred Cows: Ability Scores

[el-remmen]

Since I prefer the "see how the campaign narrative shapes your character" approach to character creation to the notion of "build" in mind as a goal, I also like rolling for stats or some other "see what you can get" method (I use a stat draft). I find arrays and point buy systems too "samey."

As for getting rid of ability scores and just having bonuses/penalties, not a fan aesthetically (I don't even like the character sheets that put the bonus above the stat and in a bigger font), but I don't think my aesthetic preferences should be the guiding principal for future iterations of D&D. That said - this may just be 38 years of D&D talking but - I find ability scores a lot easier to parse and imagine (esp. in comparison) when on a 3 to 18 range.

My other suggestion would be to keep the scores but actually have them do something aside from just give the bonus/penalty - like the number is used to calculate other things.

 

[Oofta]

Yeah, 6e should be a 'rip off the bandage' edition.

Remove everything that they keep messing around with half measures on, and let the chips fall where they may.

Rip off enough bandages and the game may bleed to death. One person's sacred cow is another person's meat.

 

[loverdrive]

Yeah, 6e should be a 'rip off the bandage' edition.

Remove everything that they keep messing around with half measures on, and let the chips fall where they may.

They did that once... And then desperately tried to roll everything back. So, I don't know if this is actually happening.

As of ability scores, I've thrown them out in Exciting Combat vol. 1 and literally nobody of playtesters ever noticed them gone until I brought that up. It's anecdotal, but it's still funny.

 

[Scribe]

Rip off enough bandages and the game may bleed to death. One person's sacred cow is another person's meat.

Then so be it.

If Wizards is convinced that their recent changes from how 5e was released are correct, then go all the way and stop trying to sit on the fence.

If they get another 4e reaction, well, at least then they know that when they go for 7e, what they need to remember is important, and that sacred cows exist for a reason.

 

[Oofta]

I don't think it really makes that much of a difference. There are a few areas where a +1 or some random number addition or subtraction is more meaningful depending on the precise values. Those would be pretty easy to iron out, I'm sure.

However, there is opportunity cost and branding. Does it really buy much of anything? Is the current system really so cumbersome that it causes issues?

 

[Professor Murder]

I'd also point out that, fundamentally, this is more a cosmetic change than a systemic change. Systemic would be to remove or fundamentally alter a system entirely, like changing what the six ability scores are while cosmetic would be changing the names but not removing any of the functions. If we eliminated Ability scores of 1 to 20 and instead listed the translated bonus only, the way the bonuses interact with the rules does not actually change in any meaningful way. Except for specific corner cases, such as tie breaks, or for more granular record keeping, the change doesn't change how the game is played.

 

[Deset Gled]

When we get a new editions, should we dispense with ability scores and just have bonuses listed instead?
A starting stat block might instead give a +3, a +2, Two +1s, a non bonus, and a -1 for example.
Besides tradition, the only reason for ability scores that are translated into bonuses is "granularity", in which one can have odd numbered scores that don't increase the bonus, acting as a stopgap between actual mechanical increases or penalties.

Thoughts?

My question is "why?" What is broken that you are trying to fix?

Things the current stat system is useful for:
Dice based stat generation
Carrying capacity
Long jump
Ability drains
Prerequisites (feats, and possibly more)
Granularity for role playing
Tradition and historical continuity

What does your new system provide that is in any way better than these options?

 

[Steampunkette]

MMmm... so...

For 6e? I dearly wish they'd step -back- a few editions.

5e having strength determine your jumping distance is pretty nice... but what about Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma?

Keep the ability scores and have the different quantities apply different exploration and social traits -alongside- skill-use.

Strength determines your jumping distance. Intelligence divided by 3 is your automatic languages at level 1, before class or background grants more, Wisdom gives you a sight-range for perception checks by determining how easily distracted you are, overall.

Not sure what to do with Charisma and Dexterity, but Constitution already determines how long you hold your breath, just make it 1 round per point of Constitution.

Heck... make stuff like this -baseline- to every skill, where your attribute score determines some aspect of the exploration or social pillar, and then your skill proficiency and bonus determine the result.

How about Persuasion can be done on a number of people equal to your charisma score divided by 2 at a given time, early on, and later on it's score x2 or x3. Allowing you to start out persuading a handful of guards or many a small crowd of legbreakers, but once you've got a few levels under your belt you can persuade a mob the side of a city block to stop a lynching, like Emperor Norton the 1st, Ruler of the United States.

Meanwhile you can Perform for a crowd equal to your Charisma Score at level 1, and that number grows as you gain levels at a similar rate...

And you can only Deceive a fraction of as many people at the start of leveling.

That'd certainly make things interesting.

 

[loverdrive]

I totally grok to people enjoying the feeling of rolling great stats.

I honestly never did understand 3E (and 5E) rolling for stats mechanism. Like, I can see rolling down the line and wondering, "who is this one gonna be?", but rolling and then distributing them yourself anyway feels weird.

 

[loverdrive]

What does your new system provide that is in any way better than these options?

Getting rid of a detail that doesn't really justify its existence.

Sometimes I wish making TTRPGs was like actually producing marvels of engineering.

Not sure what to do with Charisma and Dexterity, but Constitution already determines how long you hold your breath, just make it 1 round per point of Constitution.

Heck... make stuff like this -baseline- to every skill, where your attribute score determines some aspect of the exploration or social pillar, and then your skill proficiency and bonus determine the result.

I don't know how many people would actually remember these rules. I've personaly seen people using Str to determine jump length (or is it height?) approximately twice, and most of the time it was down to an ability check. Oh, and also there was a guy with a hilarious luchador build who grappled people, jumped 11' and dropped them to knock them prone, but that's it.