Dragonlance Dragonlance Creators Reveal Why There Are No Orcs On Krynn

Talking to the Dragonlance Nexus, Dragonlance creators Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman revealed why the world of Krynn features no orcs -- in short, because they didn't want to copy Tolkien, and orcs were very much a 'Middle Earth' thing.

Weis told Trampas Whiteman that "Orcs were also viewed as very Middle Earth. We wanted something different." Hickman added that it was draconians which made Krynn stand out. Read more at the link below!

Why are there no Orcs in Krynn? Weis and Hickman give us the answer! - Dragonlance Nexus

Dragonhelm gets the scoop from Weis and Hickman on why there are no orcs in Krynn. Read More

dragonlancenexus.com

 

[Maxperson]

Yes, exactly. That is what I was saying when I used the words of the post I was quoting.

I understood and was agreeing with you in more detail

 

[AnotherGuy]

The real issue is many on Enworld waited for the DL setting to come out before deciding to play an orc.

 

[mamba]

If adding orcs or half-orcs to Krynn somehow impacted the feel of the setting, then I’d say to not do it unless comfortable with such a change. But I’m struggling to see how doing so would really substantially change anything about Krynn at all.

and I struggle to see how choosing a different race would make any difference at all, esp for something as generic and replaceable as an orc

The lack of orcs is not what should be appealing about playing/running Dragonlance.

it isn’t, it is a side-effect

Plus, it’s all made up, so canon can just wander off and die.

If you have no interest in the world / adventure you are playing in, why did you even show up? Play something else instead that you actually are interested in

Or is your only interest to play an orc, come what may?

 

[Maxperson]

I agree 100%.

All I say is that a DM, World builder, or Setting writer should replace X with Y if X fulfills a core or base mechanical assumption of the game.

Why? If I'm really freaking sick and tired of orcs and goblins, so I invent a new, cool race to take the place of orcs, why should I scrap all my work and go with something I'm sick and tired of just because it can replace what I made?

 

[Maxperson]

The lack of orcs is not what should be appealing about playing/running Dragonlance.

To you. To me it's part of it. It was very refreshing to have a setting without orcs. It made the setting feel different.

Plus, it’s all made up, so canon can just wander off and die.

For you. For a lot of us canon is important. At least important enough to not discard it so easily as you guys are making out.

 

[Faolyn]

Only the general system has robots(Warforged) in it. Specific settings do not inherently have any given thing in the system. Setting XYZ doesn't inherently have humans, elves or dwarves. The author of that setting has to put those races in.

The general system does not have Warforged in it. And Eberron has all the stuff that regular D&D has, and more.

Schools of wizardry are not a part of the system. As DM I have to go out of my way to include them, not go out of my way to exclude them.

You realize I was using that as an example, right?

Yes it actually is a good enough answer. Nobody has a right to expect that any given monster, race or class is going to be in any given setting. What is in the game system =/= what is in a setting. What is in the game system = some of what is possible for a setting. That's why the PHB direct players(before you even get to character creation) to talk to the DM and find out what house rules there are.

If the question is "why does this setting have A, B, D, and E, but not C," and the answer is "because I didn't want to be just like the guy who made a setting with A, B, C, D, and E," then it's not a good answer. Either include C, or make the setting have A, F, J, L, and Z instead.

The DM is not obligated to put orcs into a setting, and the player has no right to expect orcs will be available. Ideally the two will discuss it, but the DM doesn't have to give a reason for why orcs aren't allowed.

Nope. But Dragonlance isn't a homebrew setting, now is it?

They gave another reason for it.

Which was, IMO, a pretty dumb reason. They didn't want to include orcs because then they'd have to include all of Middle-Earth's orc history... and yet they had no problem not including all of Middle-Earth's dwarf and elf history, despite the fact that D&D dwarfs and elves more closely resemble Tolkien's than they do mythological dwarfs or elves.

That's an unreasonable expectation. No orcs is not a good reason to expect no elves, no dwarves or no halflings.

I don't find that unreasonable at all.

 

[AnotherGuy]

All I say is that a DM, World builder, or Setting writer should replace X with Y if X fulfills a core or base mechanical assumption of the game.

Why?

 

[Minigiant]

Why? If I'm really freaking sick and tired of orcs and goblins, so I invent a new, cool race to take the place of orcs, why should I scrap all my work and go with something I'm sick and tired of just because it can replace what I made?

I'm not saying you should be forced to include orcs in your world.

I'm saying a good designer building a setting for D&D for commercial mass appeal sale would replace orcs with goliaths, minotaurs, leonin, gorillamen, hulks, aesir, some other new custom strong race, or allow players of other races to boost Strength

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Right up until you said ‘DM empowerment’ I thought you were talking about players there.
Edit: i missed the words ‘just by volunteering’ but my point stands, I think players are told they are special and unique and can have every option their way they want far too much.

Whereas I'm honestly baffled that you get this impression, especially in the present day where the viking hat is implicitly encouraged everywhere. For the first several years after 5e was published, you literally couldn't have a thread asking questions about 5e rules without someone oh-so-"helpfully" reminding the OP that, because DMs have completely plenary, arbitrary authority, you'd better check on how they run literally everything, sometimes all the way down to doing attack rolls differently.

I have literally never, not one single time, seen a game text, even in the allegedly ultra-permissive 4e, that says something even remotely like what you're describing. I have only extremely rarely seen any living DMs who take such a permissive stance.

I have seen several posters, on this very forum, who explicitly claim literally absolute authority, with which they can do literally anything they please, and if players don't like that, they are invited to express their dissent via the door.

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Why indeed.

Just have the PC elf there. Done.

Or the elf player can instead play at a different table where elves are part of the setting. That way everyone gets exactly what they want!