Dragonlance Dragonlance Creators Reveal Why There Are No Orcs On Krynn

Talking to the Dragonlance Nexus, Dragonlance creators Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman revealed why the world of Krynn features no orcs -- in short, because they didn't want to copy Tolkien, and orcs were very much a 'Middle Earth' thing.

Weis told Trampas Whiteman that "Orcs were also viewed as very Middle Earth. We wanted something different." Hickman added that it was draconians which made Krynn stand out. Read more at the link below!

Why are there no Orcs in Krynn? Weis and Hickman give us the answer! - Dragonlance Nexus

Dragonhelm gets the scoop from Weis and Hickman on why there are no orcs in Krynn. Read More

dragonlancenexus.com

 

[GMforPowergamers]

If Dragonlance is a truly unique setting, then it shouldn't matter one whit if there were orcs or not because the setting should not fall apart by their presence. The uniqueness should rest on the setting's in-game history, its nations and cultures, the types of adventures to be had there, the setting's feel and flavor. So is Dragonlance so very fragile that it can't survive the the possibility that orcs exist?

this is what i have been saying somehow the likers of DL think that orcs not being there and towers of wizardy being color coded alignment are the onyl things that make dragonlance cool or different, when I see both as foot notes at best.

 

[Velderan]

and both fall apart if orc/half orc is no longer "Only token" or "Only the nameless minons of evil" once you have orc/half orc be jsut like elves "Goood, bad, everything between" that entirely hold no water... they are NOT tolken, they are NOT soldiers of evil... they are a people.

Not really. The goblin/draconian part shifts to what role do they fill that's missing? A generic half-orcs out of the PHB isn't anything unique you couldn't cover with races already present in DL.

 

[mamba]

and both fall apart if orc/half orc is no longer "Only token" or "Only the nameless minons of evil" once you have orc/half orc be jsut like elves "Goood, bad, everything between" that entirely hold no water... they are NOT tolken, they are NOT soldiers of evil... they are a people.

‘We did not want orcs’ never falls apart

 

[mamba]

this is what i have been saying somehow the likers of DL think that orcs not being there and towers of wizardy being color coded alignment are the onyl things that make dragonlance cool or different, when I see both as foot notes at best.

the towers are not color coded…

 

[Minigiant]

Well then by your argument they probably shouldn't have been converted if they don't support the entire PHB. Any argument about DL can be applied to the MtG based material that are now checks notes campaign settings for D&D.

I think the argument is that Weiss and Hickman created Dragonlance specifically for D&D under the supervision of TSR. However it broken away from many D&D core elements at the time (no orc, no half orcs, no clerics, paladins, and ranger during the War of the Lance, most random evil humaniods absent from dungeons). Dragonlance was created for 1e D&D but cut a bunch of D&Disms.

Whether or not W&H replaced the missing elements with new ones or had good enough lore to ignore it is unknown to me as I was a baby in 1984 (was Minotaur PCs allowed in 1980s). Clearly Gen Xers and Baby Boomers loved it at the time.

However clearly WOTC is going out of their way to say how 5e DL allows previously banned classes and how newer races and classes would work in Krynn.

 

[Velderan]

this is what i have been saying somehow the likers of DL think that orcs not being there and towers of wizardy being color coded alignment are the onyl things that make dragonlance cool or different, when I see both as foot notes at best.

I mean given the fact WotC saw the Mages of High Sorcery concept as being interesting enough to make it one of their promotional videos, I'm going to guess it wasn't intended to just be a footnote.

 

[Velderan]

I think the argument is that Weiss and Hickman created Dragonlance specifically for D&D under the supervision of TSR. However it broken away from many D&D core elements at the time (no orc, no half orcs, no clerics, paladins, and ranger during the War of the Lance, most random evil humaniods absent from dungeons). Dragonlance was created for 1e D&D but cut a bunch of D&Disms.

No arguments there.

Whether or not W&H replaced the missing elements with new ones or had good enough lore to ignore it is unknown to me as I was a baby in 1984 (was Minotaur PCs allowed in 1980s). Clearly Gen Xers and Baby Boomers loved it at the time.

I don't recall there being the option to create a minotaur PC until Tales of the Lance for 2E in 1993, but it's likely the 1989 Time of the Dragon 2E set included them since minotaurs were such a large presence in that continent. It's been awhile since I've poked through that material.

Edit: a quick check that I should have made prior to posting shows minotaur PCs as being a thing in 1987's Dragonlance Adventures for 1E.

 

[Umbran]

Yes, I have experienced the race and class fetishists over the years.

Mod Note:
You know what else we have all experienced? People who are insultingly dismissive in internet discussion.

Perhaps you can give people less of that experience going forward, please and thanks.

 

[Micah Sweet]

and both fall apart if orc/half orc is no longer "Only token" or "Only the nameless minons of evil" once you have orc/half orc be jsut like elves "Goood, bad, everything between" that entirely hold no water... they are NOT tolken, they are NOT soldiers of evil... they are a people.

I'm still looking for an answer for what makes orcs worth including for worldbuilding purposes. What do they bring to the table now that their traditional purpose is gone? Getting up after being knocked to zero doesn't cut it for me.

 

[Twiggly the Gnome]

Edit: a quick check that I should have made prior to posting shows minotaur PCs as being a thing in 1987's Dragonlance Adventures for 1E.

Yeah, from the time it was a actual setting book (rather than a set railroading adventures with pregen characters), Minotaurs and Irda have been PC options.