D&D (2024) GenCon 2023 - D&D Rules Revision panel

[Scribe]

I am legitimately amused by people claiming that 5E had the wrong design ethos, in the face of its ridiculous and unprecedented success.

It's not my favorite D&D either, but come on.

I think the answer could still be that their design ethos (how they finalize or decide upon a given path) is wrong but...

5e's skeleton is good.
REALLY GOOD!
That's why it succeeded. 5e's has the best skeleton of any Fantasy RPG.

This part could also be true, and the root (along with the brand name) of 5e success.

I do believe in a genre/community that is up for modifications to the base game, the way 5e was designed is passable. It just is also going to always have detractors because it never went out to be 'something' but instead was essentially designed to straddle the fence on everything.

 

[Emberashh]

The last point is ok. For the first, please elaborate.

Your proposing that the game is successful because its good and so people buy it.

But thats not how it works. People don't actually know one way or another until they experience it for themselves.

Whats actually driving 5es success is name recognition and accessibility, both of which are things being driven by feedback loops from people and groups who rely on 5e for their own success.

None of this has anything to do with the quality of the game's design. These things would be true even if 5e was FATAL levels of bad or even on the opposite end of that scale.

 

[mamba]

Most people think it is good. Otherwise it would not sell.

then why not just keep selling the current version

 

[Scribe]

then why not just keep selling the current version

Because WoTC thinks they can churn and sell more.

GW sells a new rule set for its flagship game every 3 years or so.

 

[Minigiant]

I am legitimately amused by people claiming that 5E had the wrong design ethos, in the face of its ridiculous and unprecedented success.

It's not my favorite D&D either, but come on.

I don't think another one is saying the design ethos is bad.
People are saying the decison making was bad because the end was rushed.

I mean WOTC's only data says the Ranger class has a 21% satisfactory rating.
How did that happen if the Playtest Ranger was more or less static from when it debuted? Meaning everyone in the playtest saw it. But everyone who played the game hated it.
How did that happen?

 

[mamba]

GW sells a new rule set for its flagship game every 3 years or so.

does that actually do anything for them? Might just sit out several iterations then, I certainly won’t stay on that treadmill

 

[Scribe]

does that actually do anything for them? Might just sit out several iterations then, I certainly won’t stay on that treadmill

Yeah based on their financial statements it's a huge boost and part of their revenue planning.

 

[Reynard]

I don't think another one is saying the design ethos is bad.
People are saying the decison making was bad because the end was rushed.

I mean WOTC's only data says the Ranger class has a 21% satisfactory rating.
How did that happen if the Playtest Ranger was more or less static from when it debuted? Meaning everyone in the playtest saw it. But everyone who played the game hated it.
How did that happen?

And yet here we are with the most successful edition ever.

 

[Minigiant]

And yet here we are with the most successful edition ever.

The criticism is not on 5e's success.

It's how the 21% Ranger, 29% Berserker, 54% Champion and DMG got printed.

 

[mamba]

It's how the 21% Ranger, 29% Berserker, 54% Champion and DMG got printed.

and why we now need 70% approval to change something that did not even get half that