D&D (2024) The new warlock (Packet 7)

[Shardstone]

Multiclassing is the absolute worst design of this game and I wish I could snuff it out of existence so that classes could actually sing.

 

[Weiley31]

classes could actually sing.

We already have the Bard.

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[Veltharis ap Rylix]

Multiclassing is the absolute worst design of this game and I wish I could snuff it out of existence so that classes could actually sing.

Not all character concepts map 100% to a single class/subclass, and in game character arcs can very much alter a PC's trajectory in ways their initial class/subclass choice may not support.

 

[Shardstone]

Not all character concepts map 100% to a single class/subclass, and in game character arcs can very much alter a PC's trajectory in ways their initial class/subclass choice may not support.

THat's an argument for more classes and subclasses, not multiclassing in my eyes. The idea of dips ruins the game design IMO.

 

[Kurotowa]

And I, for one, will still be rolling Strength based paladins, while laughing the entire time as the DM of people who think making parties with all Dex and Cha characters is a great idea right up until they meet their true archnemeses: stuck doors, puzzles that require strength checks to solve, and item encumbrance. But any of you all are totally welcome to think that treating any of your 6 stats as "useless" is a good idea.

Less of a joke and more to the point: I do actually wonder if this is something that perhaps shouldn't be changed then. Honestly if making the Pacts just a feat or first level dip results in like half the player base wanting to do it I'd suggest that vears dangerously into "must have" territory and is therefore bad game design. Again, as I joked above I don't personally feel this is the case, but I'm also someone who doesn't think races with flight at level 1 are remotely overpowered in the slightest and WoTC seems convinced otherwise. shrugs.

While there's some appeal the making the Paladin more SAD with Blade Pact, there's downsides to dumping Str. For one, your AC will suffer. Plate Armor requires Str 15, and if you want to drop down to medium armor you need a Dex 14 to reach close to the same level. So you're not able to turn those both into dump stats. Not to mention that this UA made Heavy weapons require Str 13. So you can't dump Str and still make use of those nice big 2H weapons.

I'm not saying some people won't take the level dip to invert the priority between Str and Cha. But it's not a wise move to dump Str entirely, not unless you want to end up with a PC that'd be better off just playing a straight Blade Pact Warlock to begin with. It's easy for a Warlock to take Lightly Armored as their free starting feat for medium armor and shields, and Eldritch Smite is in the core book now. They'll even get a third attack at 11th level!

 

[Veltharis ap Rylix]

THat's an argument for more classes and subclasses, not multiclassing in my eyes. The idea of dips ruins the game design IMO.

And how, pray tell, does that support major, mid campaign character development that completely changes the character's story arc moving forward? A formerly non-religious character who finds religion and becomes an devout agent of their new god? A warlock who reneges on their pact and begins to chart a new path that has nothing to do with their former patron?

Locking PCs into the class/subclass they chose at the start for the entire campaign doesn't support that kind of story. Allowing at least the option for multiclassing does.

 

[Shardstone]

And how, pray tell, does that support major, mid campaign character development that completely changes the character's story arc moving forward? A formerly non-religious character who finds religion and becomes an devout agent of their new god? A warlock who reneges on their pact and begins to chart a new path that has nothing to do with their former patron?

Locking PCs into the class/subclass they chose at the start for the entire campaign doesn't support that kind of story. Allowing at least the option for multiclassing does.

People have posted so many ways around this, such as have feats that give class levels in another class but only the features, and so on. Multiclassing is not the only way to achieve what you want.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

And how, pray tell, does that support major, mid campaign character development that completely changes the character's story arc moving forward? A formerly non-religious character who finds religion and becomes an devout agent of their new god? A warlock who reneges on their pact and begins to chart a new path that has nothing to do with their former patron?

Switch their class into the new class if it matters that much to them.

We don't need to also support Fighter1/Warlock3/Rogue1/Cleric2 for these unique snowflake events.

 

[MoonSong]

People have posted so many ways around this, such as have feats that give class levels in another class but only the features, and so on. Multiclassing is not the only way to achieve what you want.

Except for the repentant Assassin that keeps grtting better at assassination and doesn't gain anything else quickly enough. Or the one who flunks wizars school and somehow keeps getting more and more spells.

 

[niklinna]

:chocola

And how, pray tell, does that support major, mid campaign character development that completely changes the character's story arc moving forward? A formerly non-religious character who finds religion and becomes an devout agent of their new god? A warlock who reneges on their pact and begins to chart a new path that has nothing to do with their former patron?

Locking PCs into the class/subclass they chose at the start for the entire campaign doesn't support that kind of story. Allowing at least the option for multiclassing does.

Or you know, getting rid of classes.