D&D (2024) Barbarian (Playtest 7)

[Parmandur]

Also I want to rant about this feature right here:

Falcon. While your Rage is active, you have a Fly Speed equal to your Speed, provided you aren’t wearing any armor.

Why does WoTC have a vendetta against flying in armor? Armor does not make flight overpowered, longbows do, and Barbarians are an explicitly melee Class! I know Barbarians have Unarmored Defense, but that's only good if you roll for stats! Otherwise, by level 14 you likely have a suit of magic armor that does something cool and makes this feature not worth it.

As one of the relatively few people who actually did play an Eagle barbarian to that level range, the limited Flight-jumping was fun! This feature is a broken promise waiting to happen.

It's less flying and more keeping the Barbarian out of armor: Unarmed Defense us a core feature of the Class.

 

[Parmandur]

Tarzan in the books is pretty much a stealthy barbarian. For that matter, even though Conan from the books is more fighter than barbarian he is pretty stealthy too.

All Barbians will want high Dex, and armor isn't inhibiting Stealth, so proficiency in Stealth is likely. And on theme.

 

[Stalker0]

It's less flying and more keeping the Barbarian out of armor: Unarmed Defense us a core feature of the Class.

So is medium armor proficiency.

Yeah I personally have a real problem with this. WOTC has made clear strides to ease up the restrictions on armor. You can now cast in it if your proficient, you can sleep in armor, it doesn't slow down your speed if your strength is high enough, etc.

If a barb is willing to invest in multiclassing or a feat to get heavy armor proficiency, than by gum let them use their abilities. A wizard can cast intricate spells in heavy armor, but a barbarian doesn't get a small rage bonus to their damage? Come on!

 

[Parmandur]

So is medium armor proficiency.

Yeah I personally have a real problem with this. WOTC has made clear strides to ease up the restrictions on armor. You can now cast in it if your proficient, you can sleep in armor, it doesn't slow down your speed if your strength is high enough, etc.

If a barb is willing to invest in multiclassing or a feat to get heavy armor proficiency, than by gum let them use their abilities. A wizard can cast intricate spells in heavy armor, but a barbarian doesn't get a small rage bonus to their damage? Come on!

I'd say that they ver specifically added these to disincentive going armored, yes.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

I love the image of a Barbarian falling in combat, only for his ghost to rise up out of his body and start beating the snot out of whoever KOd him. Technically it’s not quite what the feature describes, but it’s close enough, and is definitely how I would describe it.

That is a great image .

 

[doctorbadwolf]

That is a great image .

I really like the idea of it happening at the moment of impact of the attack that triggers it. A kill shot lands, but the body turns ethereal as it hits, the character roars with a hundred voices, and spectral wings appear or whatever as they swing their blade in vengeance, an apparition of their living self.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Scattershot thoughts!

Still love Primal Knowledge, still want a way to use it without expending a rage. Even if it is only once or twice per day without expending a rage.

Brutal Critical has never been a good feature. It wasn't good in PT 5, and now they've nerfed it in PT 7. Yes, it isn't nerfed from the PHB, but I wanted it to be heavily BUFFED from the PHB. I'm especially annoyed because the Barbarian's reckless attack + Brutal Critical was brought up alongside the Champion... and then they give the champion easy access to advantage on attacks too. Madness.

Prefer Indomitable Might earlier, especially with the skills.

I still want rage damage to equal prof mod, the scaling for rage damage is too low and too slow.

Berserker -> still awesome. Still love it.

Wild Heart -> Bear is a nerf, but not a huge one. And I'd actually allow a player to leave their two resistances "unclaimed" in a fight, and then just chose resistance when an attack hits them (I'm thinking about poisoned weapons specifically). Eagle is REALLY good.

Wolf... isn't. My problem is that while it can be a fun, it varies far too much with party comp, and it doesn't feel worth it is you have fewer than two additional melee characters. And it is REALLY unlikely you are going to have three primarily melee characters in the same party. I think I would change it to weapon attacks, instead of melee attacks.

Aspects? Heck yes! This is many times superior to the previous version, and offers a barbarian skill monkey approach which is super cool.

Power of the Wilds? Also very awesome. Maybe less powerful the more I think on it. Lion is only good if you are clumped up, so maybe extend that range a bit. Ram is good, but I have personal expeirence on knocking prone being heavily dependent on party. Buy Falcon is still good if they get rid of the armor restriction.

World Tree -> Heck yes! The vitality ability is great, but since I know they are going to nerf the temp hp I also want them to increase the healing. When you get it "heal 3 hp" isn't super cool. I think they could get away with half their rage damage in dice and it would still be an awesome support barbarian. Branch teleport, root reach increase, traveling with trees? All of it is pretty darn sweet.

Zealot -> Did the math with Divine Fury, it is usually weaker than the berserker, but when you account for them also getting +1d12 on all healing, it is pretty solid. Zealous focus is still really good. Zealous Presence should be once per short rest instead of long rest. Advantage on saves is nice, but you have to predict that it is needed, and Rage is too important to waste on an ability like this.

Rage Beyond Death... has some problems and anti-synergies actually. Some of which would be solved by being the only time I think the "spend a rage to use again" is appropriate.

The issue I see is that Relentless Rage heals you. So, what is going to happen is you are going to drop to 0, activate relentless rage and go ghost. Then you are going to be dropped to zero again, use relentless rage again.... and lose the ghost form. Also, relentless rage resets on a short rest, but this is a 1/day ability. Do you use it the first time you drop, or do you wait because it might be better later? That is a bizarre choice to make, but necessary because it is a daily ability tied to a short rest, multi-use ability.

I think I would do two things to fix it. 1) This ability lasts even if you are healed. It is thematic that it doesn't, but then relentless rage doesn't have the anti-synergy, and actually ties into the ghost form since failing relentless would then be when the form drops. 2) You can use this ability again by expending a rage when you successfully use Relentless Rage

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Scattershot thoughts!

Still love Primal Knowledge, still want a way to use it without expending a rage. Even if it is only once or twice per day without expending a rage.

Brutal Critical has never been a good feature. It wasn't good in PT 5, and now they've nerfed it in PT 7. Yes, it isn't nerfed from the PHB, but I wanted it to be heavily BUFFED from the PHB. I'm especially annoyed because the Barbarian's reckless attack + Brutal Critical was brought up alongside the Champion... and then they give the champion easy access to advantage on attacks too. Madness.

Prefer Indomitable Might earlier, especially with the skills.

I still want rage damage to equal prof mod, the scaling for rage damage is too low and too slow.

Berserker -> still awesome. Still love it.

Wild Heart -> Bear is a nerf, but not a huge one. And I'd actually allow a player to leave their two resistances "unclaimed" in a fight, and then just chose resistance when an attack hits them (I'm thinking about poisoned weapons specifically). Eagle is REALLY good.

Wolf... isn't. My problem is that while it can be a fun, it varies far too much with party comp, and it doesn't feel worth it is you have fewer than two additional melee characters. And it is REALLY unlikely you are going to have three primarily melee characters in the same party. I think I would change it to weapon attacks, instead of melee attacks.

Aspects? Heck yes! This is many times superior to the previous version, and offers a barbarian skill monkey approach which is super cool.

Power of the Wilds? Also very awesome. Maybe less powerful the more I think on it. Lion is only good if you are clumped up, so maybe extend that range a bit. Ram is good, but I have personal expeirence on knocking prone being heavily dependent on party. Buy Falcon is still good if they get rid of the armor restriction.

World Tree -> Heck yes! The vitality ability is great, but since I know they are going to nerf the temp hp I also want them to increase the healing. When you get it "heal 3 hp" isn't super cool. I think they could get away with half their rage damage in dice and it would still be an awesome support barbarian. Branch teleport, root reach increase, traveling with trees? All of it is pretty darn sweet.

Zealot -> Did the math with Divine Fury, it is usually weaker than the berserker, but when you account for them also getting +1d12 on all healing, it is pretty solid. Zealous focus is still really good. Zealous Presence should be once per short rest instead of long rest. Advantage on saves is nice, but you have to predict that it is needed, and Rage is too important to waste on an ability like this.

Rage Beyond Death... has some problems and anti-synergies actually. Some of which would be solved by being the only time I think the "spend a rage to use again" is appropriate.

The issue I see is that Relentless Rage heals you. So, what is going to happen is you are going to drop to 0, activate relentless rage and go ghost. Then you are going to be dropped to zero again, use relentless rage again.... and lose the ghost form. Also, relentless rage resets on a short rest, but this is a 1/day ability. Do you use it the first time you drop, or do you wait because it might be better later? That is a bizarre choice to make, but necessary because it is a daily ability tied to a short rest, multi-use ability.

I think I would do two things to fix it. 1) This ability lasts even if you are healed. It is thematic that it doesn't, but then relentless rage doesn't have the anti-synergy, and actually ties into the ghost form since failing relentless would then be when the form drops. 2) You can use this ability again by expending a rage when you successfully use Relentless Rage

Except for your wolf aspect assessment, I agree with you.

It may not always be the best choice, but even if you only have a single melee partner, he will love you and hug you. All the time.

 

[Stalker0]

Wolf also works great with someone with elven accuracy, as they get even more of a boost.

 

[Kurotowa]

Wolf also works great with someone with elven accuracy, as they get even more of a boost.

For certain builds. Wolf only works with melee attacks, and many Elven Accuracy builds I see are casters or archers.

Also, I'd lay a small bet that there's going to be unofficial standards for how different layers of 5e 2014 era player options will be treated. Like, Tasha's Cauldron and newer should take little or no work to pass, but stuff in the Xanathar's Guide layer may need more work. Certainly there's stuff from back then I wouldn't assume are allowed without checking first.