General star wars talk/discussion/complaining

[Zardnaar]

This is all based on a serious misunderstanding of the gaming market.

I don't know if this came up in your discussion elsewhere, but if it didn't, no-one there has any idea what they're talking about.

There's been a really big change since the early 2000s.

Game companies have realized the value of using their own IP, and the severe costs of using other people's IP. That's why Dragon Age and Mass Effect came into being, for example. So that BioWare could avoid licencing D&D (and thus working with PITA WotC) and avoid licencing Star Wars or Star Trek or the like. The cost/benefit analysis stopped working out in favour of licencing IPs.

That's why, in general, you don't see many AAA licenced titles at all. It's not like the '90s or the early '00s, where you saw dozens of them, because the market is different. Also most of those older games were AA, and the AA market is much, much smaller than it once was (and was shrinking and shrinking until fairly recently).

Another really big factor which undermines what you're saying massively is that Disney changed their approach to licencing. One of the big reasons there were so few SW games between like, 2011 and 2021 (I think, I'd need to check those dates) was Disney signed a TEN YEAR licencing contract with EA, so only EA could make Star Wars games (barring some weird sub-IPs licenced separately) in that period. Unfortunately for Disney, this was also when EA realized making stuff based on other people's IPs was less than smart, so they became a lot less keen on making Star Wars stuff. Again, was that mentioned in the discussion elsewhere? Because if not, again, people don't know what they're talking about.

Further, now Disney has opened it up so more companies can SW games, not just EA, but they are apparently using pretty aggressive licencing terms, very much unlike, say, Games Workshop and Warhammer. Games Workshop are almost just happy you're making games with their brands - they tightly monitor them and can be a PITA that way, but they don't want large revenue cuts. Sometimes they don't ask for a revenue cut at all with smaller companies. Disney aren't like that. I don't have any exact figures, because this is all NDA'd stuff, but Disney have apparently been asking for "large" revenue shares from people who want to use the licence. This makes people much less likely to want to make Star Wars games - because it makes it a lot harder to make a profit.

All this airy-fairy stuff about "organic enthusiasm" and so on is kind of meaningless when these three factors are so important.

Those are explanations doesn't change the trajectory of what we were saying.

Old EU was active for 23 years regardless of movies.

And ultimately signing a ten year exclusive deal is on Disney.

 

[MGibster]

But it has to have iconic whistling tune.

It's been done.

 

[MGibster]

Another really big factor which undermines what you're saying massively is that Disney changed their approach to licencing. One of the big reasons there were so few SW games between like, 2011 and 2021 (I think, I'd need to check those dates) was Disney signed a TEN YEAR licencing contract with EA, so only EA could make Star Wars games (barring some weird sub-IPs licenced separately) in that period. Unfortunately for Disney, this was also when EA realized making stuff based on other people's IPs was less than smart, so they became a lot less keen on making Star Wars stuff. Again, was that mentioned in the discussion elsewhere? Because if not, again, people don't know what they're talking about.

Wasn't Disney a little unhappy with game publishers making crummy games with their IP? I remember a lot of backlash to Star Wars: Battlefront II because it took 40+ hours of grinding to be able to unlock Darth Vader as a character.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Those are explanations doesn't change the trajectory of what we were saying.

Old EU was active for 23 years regardless of movies.

They don't change the trajectory, but the reasons for the trajectory are completely different to the ones you were speculating about.

Also the old EU SW games were not hugely successful, by and large. The only very successful SW games, like real big sellers in that era, that I can think of, were ones actually based on the OT.

And games based on the PT were also in many cases very successful - much more successful than well-loved stuff like Tie Fighter or Dark Forces.

(Also wouldn't it be closer to 35 years? i.e. 1977 to 2012? Not sure where the 23 year figure is coming from)

And ultimately signing a ten year exclusive deal is on Disney.

Sure? And that matters why?

You're concerned about there being fewer SW games, and you came up with some theories about "organic enthusiasm" and so on. But the real main explanation is that Disney only want to licence out their IP in deals that make them a lot of money, rather than being keen to licence out the appeal to a lot of people, like LucasFilm was keen to.

 

[Zardnaar]

They don't change the trajectory, but the reasons for the trajectory are completely different to the ones you were speculating about.

Also the old EU SW games were not hugely successful, by and large. The only very successful SW games, like real big sellers in that era, that I can think of, were ones actually based on the OT.

And games based on the PT were also in many cases very successful - much more successful than well-loved stuff like Tie Fighter or Dark Forces.

(Also wouldn't it be closer to 35 years? i.e. 1977 to 2012? Not sure where the 23 year figure is coming from)

Sure? And that matters why?

You're concerned about there being fewer SW games, and you came up with some theories about "organic enthusiasm" and so on. But the real main explanation is that Disney only want to licence out their IP in deals that make them a lot of money, rather than being keen to licence out the appeal to a lot of people, like LucasFilm was keen to.

KotoR sold millions of copies.

Entire EU is 30 odd years bit there was very little post RotJ and 1991. Late 80s it was an RPG line.

1991 it blew up again with active support 1991-2014. It really picked up steam 1994. 1991-93 was really the Thrawn Trilogy and Dark Empire. 1993 X-Wing game came out.

Lots of games with comparatively high ratings.

Multiple eras as well with Disney struggling with sequal era and high republic. Old EU had Old Republic, prequels, clone wars, dark times, OT, New Republic, NJO and legacy eras.

You had things like Shadows of the Empire which crossed over into novel and comic iirc. Rogue Squadron on N64 then GameCube version.

Lots of RTS games. First person shooters, RPGs. Hell 90s had platformers. Support on 4 generations of consoles.

EU enthusiasm lead to 1997 re-releases and the prequels. Hell they filmed new footage in 1995 and that got reported on (Vader vs Duracell bunny).

 

[trappedslider]

this will make people happy

Lucasfilm Boss Kathleen Kennedy Expected to Retire This Year

The prolific producer has presided over the 'Star Wars' and 'Indiana Jones' franchises through ups and downs since 2012.

www.yahoo.com

 

[Ruin Explorer]

this will make people happy

Lucasfilm Boss Kathleen Kennedy Expected to Retire This Year

The prolific producer has presided over the 'Star Wars' and 'Indiana Jones' franchises through ups and downs since 2012.

www.yahoo.com

Only people who don't understand how the film industry works and who irrationally blame Kennedy (definitely in part because she's a woman, let's be real for one second here) for Star Wars' problems, but ignore anything good getting made in the same era.

She's the reason Rogue One is okay rather than total rubbish, for example, and that Andor got made.

Kind of worried who we'll get in next honestly. God help us all if it's Favreau.

 

[Zardnaar]

Only people who don't understand how the film industry works and who irrationally blame Kennedy (definitely in part because she's a woman, let's be real for one second here) for Star Wars' problems, but ignore anything good getting made in the same era.

She's the reason Rogue One is okay rather than total rubbish, for example, and that Andor got made.

Kind of worried who we'll get in next honestly. God help us all if it's Favreau.

She's the greatest producer of all time. May not be the best head of LucasFilm though. The rotating cast of directors and announcements of dead projects ultimately that's on her.

For the ST though she may have been over ruled by Iger hence the rush.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

The rotating cast of directors and announcements of dead projects ultimately that's on her.

Yeah it is though we shouldn't forget it was "the fashion at the time", in that weird post-The Rise of Skywalker, post-Game of Thrones period before the pandemic really came down loads and loads of projects were announced and then promptly went absolutely nowhere. Not just ones involving Kennedy.

I think the pandemic got most of them. Basically 2019-2021 was a wild, wild time for announcing projects which then didn't actually go anywhere in the film industry. Maybe expand it out a couple of years even.

 

[trappedslider]

First poster for the 20th anniversary of ‘REVENGE OF THE SITH’The film will be re-released in theaters on April 25.