Spoilers Daredevil: Born Again (Spoilers)

Thomas Shey said:

Seems unlikely for one reason: Bullseye would have had absolutely no need to get that close.

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I wonder about that, yeah. But that could be a misdirect, and the killer certainly had a build close to Bullseye.

Thomas Shey said:

Nothing says he didn't have backup. That looked like walking WT into an ambush situation given the female scream right before it attracting his attention. The backup just wasn't needed.

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Sure, but we didn't see any evidence, and he walked calmly away in a supremely confident manner, and I don't think a normal cop who just killed a superhuman is going to be doing that.

Ruin Explorer said:

Exactly. And it definitely wasn't the cop. The movie to out him as White Tiger was the smart one (and they'd have killed him either way).

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It allowed Matt to present his past history and ask the question "Why would this man suddenly decide to just at attack (and kill one of) two innocent men?" Especially since the back history doesn't seem to suggest White Tiger was murderous as a vigilante (maybe less so than Matt's sometimes been).

Ruin Explorer said:

For sure. But a little light-weight body-armour and maybe a helmet just seems like the smart move. The might not save you, but they've sure saved Matt! Night Thrasher knew where it was at!

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Sometimes easier to come by than others, however, especially if you're based around agility. Matt had the advantage in the original show that he essentially stumbled a low-end street level armorer-genius. Barring that or some non-trivial money (and contacts) not everyone can do that. And note as far as we can tell he'd gotten by a fair long time without it.

Ruin Explorer said:

(When are we getting our Night Thrasher series eh Marvel?)

Yeah I suspect these cops better hope he doesn't find out. Also he probably will find out.

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Yup to both.

Thomas Shey said:

It allowed Matt to present his past history and ask the question "Why would this man suddenly decide to just at attack (and kill one of) two innocent men?" Especially since the back history doesn't seem to suggest White Tiger was murderous as a vigilante (maybe less so than Matt's sometimes been).

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Yep, Matt just had to beat the burden of reasonable doubt, and in this case he was able to put in that doubt with this question. I mean....isn't it really strange that this guy who does nothing but wander around saving people and helping cops would just kill one?

The answer....yeah seems pretty doubtful.

Stalker0 said:

Yep, Matt just had to beat the burden of reasonable doubt, and in this case he was able to put in that doubt with this question. I mean....isn't it really strange that this guy who does nothing but wander around saving people and helping cops would just kill one?

The answer....yeah seems pretty doubtful.

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Quite. "Sometimes good people do bad things!" says the prosecutor - yeah like cheating on their spouse or their taxes, or maybe shoplifting due to mental health or something. Not "running up to two random cops at a train station and bodily hurling one of them in front of a train for zero reason"!

Ruin Explorer said:

I feel like if it was just cop-cultists, there'd have been more than one of them, possibly an entire team with long guns. Only bringing one guy to kill someone with superhuman strength and speed suggests pretty serious confidence.

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Note that a police SUV rolls up in the background right as White Tiger gets shot. Given that we have deliberately been shown two dirty cops with the Punisher tattoo (modified with a backwards American-ish flag), we are likely meant to wonder how the Punisher fits in, but ultimately conclude it’s probably an ambush set up by the dirty cops. Given that it is edited into a monologue from Fisk (and because he’s Kingpin), I think we are likely meant to assume he’s pulling the strings. These could be misdirects, but…we’ll see.

I do wonder how Matt’s inability to see the tattoos is going to complicate things.

Assuming the ambush was made considerably easier to pull off by knowing White Tiger’s identity and probably tailing him, I also wonder how guilty Matt’s going to feel about unethically getting him killed and putting his family in danger.

The Matt we saw in She Hulk fought against this kind of thing. This Matt seems broken, driven by a single-minded need to prove…something, and willing to sacrifice others to do it (while also convincing himself that he’s doing the right thing for them).

Rune said:

This Matt seems broken, driven by a single-minded need to prove…something

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That the system works, so he doesn't have to fix it by being daredevil. That is the obstacle that Matt faces this season...he wants to desperately believe that justice will be served him being a lawyer, rather than requiring the violence he has tried to give up.

But considering the title of the show, I am going to assume it does not

Stalker0 said:

That the system works, so he doesn't have to fix it by being daredevil. That is the obstacle that Matt faces this season...he wants to desperately believe that justice will be served him being a lawyer, rather than requiring the violence he has tried to give up.

But considering the title of the show, I am going to assume it does not

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Probably. But I think that’s wrapped up in trying to prove that he’s not like Fisk. And in pursuit of that goal, he kind of is.

That there was some pretty good TV.

It's been a while since i've had a show that I actually look forward to seeing. Here's hoping that this show does well enough that the whole "street level hero" thing can get some legs again. Luke Cage I liked. Jessica Jones I loved. Moon Knight can be street level, but, it doesn't look like that's going to go ahead. :'(

Maybe a Spider Woman? Trying to think of some others that I might like to see.

He's had this flaw through the later seasons.

Stalker0 said:

Its the MCU I will never say never....but unlike Coulson who had the backing of an agency with access to the world's resources and every bit of alien tech and mystical voodoo ever found....Foggy is just a lawyer. There wouldn't be any reason (or frankly means) for anyone to bring him back.

If he comes back in anything I think it would be flashbacks, perhaps between the end of OG Daredevil and this new show so we catchup on some elements there.

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They really wouldn't need a reason for anyone to bring him back. His heart stopped. We don't know how long the ambulance took to get there, but paddles could have brought him back if not too many minutes passed by. I think he's dead, but they don't need a super power or magic to bring the man back if that's what they want to do.