D&D 5E 20th level Sorcerer vs the world

[Gammadoodler]

The Sorcerer doesn't need be stationary 10 minutes, the Sorcerer can expend his action each turn, but It can move and bonus action normally.

Shocking Grasp + Quicken Polymorph is a death sensence to be a Chicken Statue.

The wizard, and your sorcerer need to be within range of the area you are using for the sanctum when you start the spell.

The wizard, after their simulacrum is removed is likely either using their action to fight or flee, and will have 10 minutes using movements, actions, and potentially bonus actions to do so. Meanwhile, best case scenario, the sorcerer is following along at half pace only using their movement, subtly mumbling to themselves and looking for an area to cast the sanctum (under the most permissive of interpretations).

Then assuming you somehow get the sanctum up with the wizard in it, you have to get within 30 feet without breaking stealth and win initiative (once that simulacrum is dispelled, surprise is done, the wizard is aware of you and looking to fight or flee) to land your combo. And even then you have to land both pieces of your combo. And even then, you'd need a second caster as flesh to Stone and polymorph are both concentration spells.

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

Why waste Wish?
If you are stealthy casting.

Because the Wizard won't stay for 10 minutes after being targeted by a dispel. Heck, he could SIMPLY WALK for 10 rounds and be 3,000 ft away...

"Planar travel is blocked within the warded area."
Demiplane is useless.

Depending on DM's interpretation. Planar travel is travel between planes, a demiplane is by definition not a plane: it could be read as being a subset of a plane or it could be decided to be something else. Extending planar travel definition to demiplane would be a prime example of DM fiat.

1 turn casting Dispel that can be counterspelled. Now the Sorcerer and his Simulacrum Polymorph you into a Mighty Chicken.

The hasted wizard didn't cast Dispel. You're probably mistaking him for someone else.

 

[Jfdlsjfd]

The Sorcerer doesn't need be stationary 10 minutes, the Sorcerer can expend his action each turn, but It can move and bonus action normally.

But having a Private Sanctum popping 10 minutes walk away from where he was cast wouldn't very useful... Unless you appeal to DM fiat, the range is not moving with you.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

I have lost track a bit....

How is the sorcerer flying above the battlefield Hiding in the first place. Was there an invisibility in there somewhere, because both of those are Concentration and preclude other Concentration abilities.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Also interesting how any PC with the alert feat is going to beat most of this combo.

 

[Hohige]

Also interesting how any PC with the alert feat is going to beat most of this combo.

Interesting that We dont have wizard build against The Bastion.
A distant Shocking Grasp + Quicken Polymorph into a Chicken defeat them.
Just theorical Wizard with 450 prepared spells and with ALL feats.

 

[prabe]

Interesting that We dont have wizard build against The Bastion.
A distant Shocking Grasp + Quicken Polymorph into a Chicken defeat them.

Any wizard with Alert feat is unsurprised, and there are ways (I can think of at least three, with some overlap) to at least improve the odds of having a better initiative than your Bastion. If we're building wizards to be paranoid (which isn't fun, but whatever) then Sorcerer Initiate for a couple points and subtle-cast Teleport to get away or any of a number of other spells before your Bastion has a turn.

But that's not real important. What I persist in noticing is that you keep not responding to what a fair fight really--the way to test your build--is: No wish, no simulacrum, pick a starting distance and roll Initiative. You don't want that. You want all the time in the world to prep your character (because your DM likes you, I guess) and you don't want to allow the wizard any similar opportunity (mainly because when they have that opportunity the sorcerer dies, I suppose).

 

[Benjamin Olson]

Interesting that We dont have wizard build against The Bastion.
A distant Shocking Grasp + Quicken Polymorph into a Chicken defeat them.

My last Wizard character in actual play was a Changeling, so she had defeated this particular strategy at level 1 by being immune to Polymorph.

 

[Hohige]

Any wizard with Alert feat is unsurprised, and there are ways (I can think of at least three, with some overlap) to at least improve the odds of having a better initiative than your Bastion. If we're building wizards to be paranoid (which isn't fun, but whatever) then Sorcerer Initiate for a couple points and subtle-cast Teleport to get away or any of a number of other spells before your Bastion has a turn.

But that's not real important. What I persist in noticing is that you keep not responding to what a fair fight really--the way to test your build--is: No wish, no simulacrum, pick a starting distance and roll Initiative. You don't want that. You want all the time in the world to prep your character (because your DM likes you, I guess) and you don't want to allow the wizard any similar opportunity (mainly because when they have that opportunity the sorcerer dies, I suppose).

The Bastion doesnt care about Alert feat. The Wizard is defenseless against The Bastion.
I disagree, with Trance of Order minimum 12 initiative with magical Guidance.
The best that a Wizard can do is try survive.
The Sorcerer is stronger and versatile.
The game isnt arena. The Power of class is everything, RAW Power, skill checks, social skills.

 

[Krachek]

Interesting that We dont have wizard build against The Bastion.
A distant Shocking Grasp + Quicken Polymorph into a Chicken defeat them.
Just theorical Wizard with 450 prepared spells and with ALL feats.

I can see some scenarios for the Campaign « The hidden enemy » that setup the mighty sorcerer vs the World.

Scenario A
The DM state that there is a hidden leader of the world, and he assume by RAW that the players cannot use spell, abiltity or succeed any skill check to discover its identity, location, to counter any of its action. So at the beginning of each session, the DM simply list the exploit of the hidden leader.

Scenario B.
The DM bait its high level PC party in the hidden leader lair, and repeatedly beat them up. It is done each time with long debate on rules application. but since the DM is the referee and the opponent at the same time, the hidden leader always win.

Scenario C
A crappy pc party decide to take down the leader. They manage a plan to know its identity. The Dm is pretty embarrassed, and because the players only care about this plan, he finally let the party begin a long quest that eventually let the pc know the identity of the leader.
Then the party have a plan to shutdown the leader defense, turn its minions and simulacrum against him, bait him outside its lair and defeat him. Again the DM is pretty annoyed about this, but since the main purpose of the game is to let PC be heroes and succeed their plans, he feel compel to let them play in this way. They begin a long quest, and even if they are low level and crappy pc, the clockwork Xp budget rules make them succeed their quests. The plan is finally setup and they will defeat the hidden leader. That is a good story.