5E: Converting Monsters from White Dwarf Magazine for Fifth Edition

[ilgatto]

Maybe a combination or the two? Regular sized Header and Type name, maybe with regular sided to Hit?

Dragon Warriors Combat Table

Type​	Element​	Saves & Skills²​	Hit​	Damage (with Longsword)​
Black	acid​	DEX +4, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 acid)​
Blue	lightning​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +4, CHA +3​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 lightning)​
Green	poison¹​	DEX +3, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 poison)​
Red	fire​	DEX +3, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5​	+7​	18 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing & 2d4 fire)​
White	cold​	DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +3, CHA +1​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 cold)​
Brass	fire​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Bronze	lightning​	DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +4, CHA +3​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Copper	acid​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +3​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Gold	fire​	DEX +5, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5​	+7​	13 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing)​
Silver	cold​	DEX +4, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +4​	+7​	12 (1d10+1d4+4 slashing)​

1 a green dragon warrior is also immune to the poisoned condition.
2 DEX (Stealth) and WIS (Perception) skills are equal to the Saving Throws.

Yeah, that looks pretty good.

Will put it in the Dragon Warriors.

Can't you move the word "Hit" and the numbers in the Hit column underneath to the left (what's that called? align?) It looks a bit awkward now.

 

[Cleon]

Not really sure how Jason and the other guy (Cadmus?, I forget) commanded their dragon warriors, but I'd assume they used their own language. So I'd normally say Common would be enough, but since you've sort of made them "entities in their own right" rather than "magically created", I guess adding Draconic would be appropriate?
If you catch my drift.

I've given Common, Draconic in the Dragon Warriors' Languages as that's standard issue for Dragons.

Currently my favoured approach is to have the magic item allow the dragon warrior it becomes to understand what its owner says, but it can only speak in Common and Draconic.

Presumably the tooth like the similar figurine of wondrous power magically grants the resulting creature the ability to understand its activator's instructions regardless of the Intelligence and Languages of the creature.

After all, figurines of wondrous power permits a Giant Fly (ebony fly) or Goat (ivory goats) with Intelligence 2 and Languages — to comprehend spoken commands.

It's the ability to talk back that needs to be pointed out (i.e. the onyx dox can speak Common) if the creature itself doesn't normally have a Language. A serpentine owl would be able to speak Giant Owl since the SRD version can.

 

[ilgatto]

That's getting more complicated than 5E prefers though, but I do like to over-complicate things!

You should have stuck to 2E!

 

[Cleon]

Can't you move the word "Hit" and the numbers in the Hit column underneath to the left (what's that called? align?) It looks a bit awkward now.

Yeah, that's simple enough. Just edit the code so RIGHT becomes LEFT:

Dragon Warriors Combat Table

Type​	Element​	Saves & Skills²​	Hit​	Damage (with Longsword)​
Black	acid​	DEX +4, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 acid)​
Blue	lightning​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +4, CHA +3​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 lightning)​
Green	poison¹​	DEX +3, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 poison)​
Red	fire​	DEX +3, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5​	+7​	18 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing & 2d4 fire)​
White	cold​	DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +3, CHA +1​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 cold)​
Brass	fire​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Bronze	lightning​	DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +4, CHA +3​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Copper	acid​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +3​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Gold	fire​	DEX +5, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5​	+7​	13 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing)​
Silver	cold​	DEX +4, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +4​	+7​	12 (1d10+1d4+4 slashing)​

1 a green dragon warrior is also immune to the poisoned condition.
2 DEX (Stealth) and WIS (Perception) skills are equal to the Saving Throws.

Or CENTER:

Dragon Warriors Combat Table

Type​	Element​	Saves & Skills²​	Hit​	Damage (with Longsword)​
Black	acid​	DEX +4, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 acid)​
Blue	lightning​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +4, CHA +3​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 lightning)​
Green	poison¹​	DEX +3, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 poison)​
Red	fire​	DEX +3, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5​	+7​	18 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing & 2d4 fire)​
White	cold​	DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +3, CHA +1​	+6​	13 (1d10+4 slashing & 1d6 cold)​
Brass	fire​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +2​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Bronze	lightning​	DEX +2, CON +5, WIS +4, CHA +3​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Copper	acid​	DEX +2, CON +4, WIS +3, CHA +3​	+6​	9½ (1d10+4 slashing)​
Gold	fire​	DEX +5, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +5​	+7​	13 (1d10+1d6+4 slashing)​
Silver	cold​	DEX +4, CON +6, WIS +5, CHA +4​	+7​	12 (1d10+1d4+4 slashing)​

1 a green dragon warrior is also immune to the poisoned condition.
2 DEX (Stealth) and WIS (Perception) skills are equal to the Saving Throws.

Let's see… There isn't really much difference between the two, so I might as well use the LEFT, if only because it'd make it slightly easier to edit the code of that column in Microsoft Word.

I also forgot to make the ¹ note after poison normal sized in the previous post.

Updating the Dragon Warriors.

 

[ilgatto]

I've given Common, Draconic in the Dragon Warriors' Languages as that's standard issue for Dragons.

Currently my favoured approach is to have the magic item allow the dragon warrior it becomes to understand what its owner says, but it can only speak in Common and Draconic.

Sounds like the way to go unless you want them to have some specific heritage/origins/makers?

Though that may complicate things...

 

[Cleon]

Sounds like the way to go unless you want them to have some specific heritage/origins/makers?

Though that may complicate things...

Well as I said earlier I'm not going to worry about the magic item until I finish the Description proper.

 

[Cleon]

Not really sure how Jason and the other guy (Cadmus?, I forget) commanded their dragon warriors, but I'd assume they used their own language.

Well if you're talking about the original myth, just going be memory King Cadmus of Phrygia (?) challenged Jason to harness two fire-breathing man-eating brazen bulls and use them to sow a field with dragon's teeth, each of which would sprout into a fully armed warrior that would strive to kill Jason as soon as they saw him.

Following the advice of Medea, Jason tamed the bulls (with a magical bridle or the like IIRC) and then threw a ball into the middle of the warriors, who immediately started fighting each other to the death to possess the pretty toy.

There's at least one version were a few of the warriors survived and married human women to found a tribe.

I'd have to actual look it up to confirm the details, but I think the general outline is correct.

 

[ilgatto]

Well if you're talking about the original myth, just going be memory King Cadmus of Phrygia (?) challenged Jason to harness two fire-breathing man-eating brazen bulls and use them to sow a field with dragon's teeth, each of which would sprout into a fully armed warrior that would strive to kill Jason as soon as they saw him.

Following the advice of Medea, Jason tamed the bulls (with a magical bridle or the like IIRC) and then threw a ball into the middle of the warriors, who immediately started fighting each other to the death to possess the pretty toy.

There's at least one version were a few of the warriors survived and married human women to found a tribe.

I'd have to actual look it up to confirm the details, but I think the general outline is correct.

Checking Cadmus in wikipedia:

Intending to sacrifice the cow to Athena, Cadmus sent some of his companions, Deioleon and Seriphus to the nearby Ismenian spring for water. They were slain by the spring's guardian water-dragon (compare the Lernaean Hydra), which was in turn destroyed by Cadmus, the duty of a culture hero of the new order.

He was then instructed by Athena to sow the dragon's teeth in the ground, from which there sprang a race of fierce armed men, called the Spartoi ("sown"). By throwing a stone among them, Cadmus caused them to fall upon one another until only five survived, who assisted him to build the Cadmeia or citadel of Thebes, and became the founders of the noblest families of that city.

So maybe the 5E dragon teeth should be the teeth of an actual dragon? That would sort of solve the maximum-of-four as well as the teeth-having-to-be-a-magic-item "problems" and it may well be what WD21 intended since it doesn't mention them being magic items.
Or would that mean messing with the 5E dragon descriptions?

 

[Cleon]

Checking Cadmus in wikipedia:

That's hilarious, I remembered the events in the myth roughly correctly but the names were completely wrong. I could have sworn there were versions of the Dragon's Teeth story were Jason (of the Argonauts fame) was the one doing the tooth-sowing.

Probably the influence of the late great Ray Harryhausen!

So maybe the 5E dragon teeth should be the teeth of an actual dragon? That would sort of solve the maximum-of-four as well as the teeth-having-to-be-a-magic-item "problems" and it may well be what WD21 intended since it doesn't mention them being magic items.

Thought we'd already decided that you couldn't just yank out the tooth of a SRD dragon and throw it to the ground to create a Dragon Warrior?

I'd mention the "straight from the mouth" version in the Description as the mythic origins of the original Dragon Warriors, and that there are magic items that mimic their origins.

Unless you're asking whether the magic item dragon teeth are made from an actual dragon's tooth, which I'd say it obviously is!

 

[ilgatto]

That's hilarious, I remembered the events in the myth roughly correctly but the names were completely wrong. I could have sworn there were versions of the Dragon's Teeth story were Jason (of the Argonauts fame) was the one doing the tooth-sowing.

No worries. He did. I guess Apollonius hi-jacked the Cadmus story. Not unusual. Think Iliad/Aeneid. And national heroes slaying dragons is of all ages, too (e.g., St. George).

Probably the influence of the late great Ray Harryhausen!

Had to look him up!

Thought we'd already decided that you couldn't just yank out the tooth of a SRD dragon and throw it to the ground to create a Dragon Warrior?

Ah, yes. There is that.

I'd mention the "straight from the mouth" version in the Description as the mythic origins of the original Dragon Warriors, and that there are magic items that mimic their origins.

OK.

Unless you're asking whether the magic item dragon teeth are made from an actual dragon's tooth, which I'd say it obviously is!

Nah. Just musing - I tend to do that. I shall strive to do better.