D&D 5E 5e isn't a Golden Age of D&D Lorewise, it's Silver at best.

[Charlaquin]

I’m saying some people want settings to be specific and “real” and WoTC has abandoned that idea, they’re just going to say, “ here’s some ideas, but do whatever you want” and I’m saying that’s hard for some who want their settings to be specific and ”real” outside their own game/ideas.

Ah, ok, that makes sense. Thanks for clarifiying!

 

[delericho]

One of the problems WotC has is that there is a lot of lore of very mixed quality, some of which is clearly problematic, quite a bit of which is regarded as at least potentially problematic, and some of which has been reassessed since 5e has come out.

So they're in a position where they don't really want to make sweeping changes (since every bit of lore you change is somebody's favourite), while at the same time having to make significant changes, all while dealing with a moving target. Sometimes I'm surprised they don't launch a Multiverse Shaking Event, wipe the slate completely clean, and start again.

 

[Morrus]

3rd parties shouldn't be vastly out doing WotC on quality & support of their settings. I bought the core 5e Southland books from their Kickstarter and it straight up kicks the ass of WotC's best, most well done 5e setting books. Its not alone in doing so.

Why shouldn't they? A small publisher has different goals to a large one, and can cater to a niche far better. This is pretty much what the OGL was designed for -- to allow third party publishers to do the stuff that doesn't work for much broader audiences. Seems to me everything is working as intended.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

Why shouldn't they? A small publisher has different goals to a large one, and can cater to a niche far better. This is pretty much what the OGL was designed for -- to allow third party publishers to do the stuff that doesn't work for much broader audiences. Seems to me everything is working as intended.

WotC should be the gold standard for their edition, its not even close in 5e. I see no reason WotC can't do as well as Southlands for its settings.

 

[Morrus]

WotC should be the gold standard for their edition, its not even close in 5e. I see no reason WotC can't do as well as Southlands for its settings.

They do do “as well”. They just measure success differently to you.

 

[dave2008]

5e might mechanically be the best system and it's certainly the most popular (possibly soon to be even more so), but is far from D&D's second golden age.

It simply doesn't approach AD&D depth of lore, heck it doesn't even out do Basic D&D on lore. This isn't an edition war post, mechncally and certain other ways 5e is my favourite edition, but I don't pretend its something its not, a golden age.

Social Media/Pop culture is fueling D&D's popularity. Playtesters pushed WotC in a direction, accidentily, that just dove tailed with streaming and other cultural pheonomana.

Compare to AD&D the lore is extremely shallow, occasionally self contradictory in the sane book, shallow (deserved to be said twice), and often is starved for room because 5e books try to be too many things at once, and so do few to none of them well.

Hell even 4e had deeper dives into settings it did.

It also confusingly mixes generic D&D lore with FR lore sowing confusion. I'm still baffled by much of MToFs lore and parts of VGtM.

3rd parties shouldn't be vastly out doing WotC on quality & support of their settings. I bought the core 5e Southland books from their Kickstarter and it straight up kicks the ass of WotC's best, most well done 5e setting books. Its not alone in doing so. I wish WotC supported it's settings half as well as Kobold press does there's. Honestly the paper quality and the binding quality for Southlands is also vastly superior.

Also they killed most of the novel lines in 5e just as things were getting good. This we do not forgive or forget!





So no it's not a Golden Age, it's system and current popular earn it silver at best.

What is your criteria for determining a "Golden Age." If it simply lore, well that means almost nothing to me. I haven't really used or cared about D&D lore since the 1e MM and DD (except for 4e). The whole idea of using "lore" to determine a "golden age" is just silly to me.

Also, you rave about 5e 3PP lore, then shouldn't that be add into the calculation of what constitutes "golden age" lore. WotC isn't the alpha and omega of lore for this or any edition.

 

[dave2008]

WotC should be the gold standard for their edition,

Why?

its not even close in 5e.

In your opinion. I guess I agree, but IMO opinion that was true in 1e, 2e, & 3e too (if we include TSR in the discussion).

I see no reason WotC can't do as well as Southlands for its settings.

What is doing well to you. What is good lore to you? This is all your perspective, and that is fine, but I am a little tired of people taking the tone that they know what is best for me.

Personally I think 4e and 5e had the best lore additions to D&D since the early days of AD&D (by this I mean the MM (and MM2) & Deities and Demigods lore)

 

[MadArkitekt]

I disagree.

For the most part, every lore change made for 5E has — against mainstream opinion — been a success in my eyes. I think elves are far more interesting and playable and worth thinking about then before, I think the infernal war machines makes Hell a lot cooler, and things like the Raven Queen I find far more interesting with her new lore as compared to the old.

All perspective, I guess!

On the other hand we loose interesting back story. Like how Kenku were curse to be wingless by Grazz’t. Additionally, beholders lack the motivation they once had as they’re no longer the raging xenophobes they once were (yes I realize someone can read into that and see parallels with Nazis xenophobia but let’s be real. The beholder is a fictional alien that’s shoots various forms of death from the many tentacle-mounted eyeballs covering its body)

Back to the lore, it feels in WotC making everything more accessible or flexible, the races and classes lose their uniqueness.

 

[dave2008]

On the other hand we loose interesting back story. Like how Kenku were curse to be wingless by Grazz’t. Additionally, beholders lack the motivation they once had as they’re no longer the raging xenophobes they once were (yes I realize someone can read into that and see parallels with Nazis xenophobia but let’s be real. The beholder is a fictional alien that’s shoots various forms of death from the many tentacle-mounted eyeballs covering its body)

Back to the lore, it feels in WotC making everything more accessible or flexible, the races and classes lose their uniqueness.

Of course beholder gains some really cool new lore in the process, so YMMV obviously.

 

[MadArkitekt]

Of course beholder gains some really cool new lore in the process, so YMMV obviously.

In which case I stand corrected. Of what lore do you speak? Spelljammer material? Like Large Luigi serving drinks in the Laughing Beholder on the Rock of Bral? (So psyched to have him in a campaign)