A mystery race ?

[HeavenShallBurn]

I realize plenty of other games have had orcs and other monsters as PCs. But I think WoW is the major force in making them popular.

I've also never liked monstrous races as PCs, and I fully realize that's my opinion and I'm not trying to change anyone's. But I just don't think that Orcs belong in the PHB as a core race. I like my Orcs like Tolkein's orcs...evil, nasty, and totally unredeemable. But I must admit that that is just one interpretation of orcs these days....

But my unjustifiable and not well-defended opinion is that the game would be better without orcs or drow as core PC races. We'll see in Dec!

We're about as far apart on the spectrum as possible, I've never played a human character once. I've played in entire campaigns where the standard races either never showed up or were handled as monsters. I've GM'ed entire settings where none of the core races even existed. But I certainly don't begrudge your style or expect to see monstrous races replace the standard ones. I think I speak for many in my position, especially considering that monsters will use different rules than PCs in 4e. When I do expect that at the least as a concession to the fact that our playstyle exists the designers should include a section in the DMG showing exactly how they balanced the racial traits of the core classes and what system if any they used to do so in order to more easily create monstrous PC races that balance well against the PHB races.

EDIT: Three elf-ish races would be too much, two is too much in my opinion and they should just go elf and dump the half-elf to open a place for more variety but I doubt that will happen. But I'm also a well-known elf hater so I realize many actually like the pointy-eared idgits and that's not likely to happen.

 

[Reaper Steve]

Orcs, I don't mind at all. I've kinda wanted them to have a good spread of races over the good to neutral to evil spectrum for a while, and they seem to be heading that way.

I think that's part of the point of the Tiefling. It replaces the evil, dumb brute half-orc with a sinister, thinking, tied-to-evil-whether-it-likes-it-or-not new race.

FWIW, my opinions aren't carved in stone. If they can justify 'orcs as core PCs' with style, I can be persuaded. I just hope I don't have to be!

 

[Reaper Steve]

Also FWIW, PC race or not, I hope they re-re-imagine orcs. I really don't care for the 3E gray-skinned semi-neanderthal look.

I know, Gears of War locusts instead! (I'm pretty serious.)

 

[Scholar & Brutalman]

Three elfesque races is too much.

I'm really surprised the half-elf is still there. Wizards did a lot of good work in 3rd edition to wean players off playing half-elves and they have a beautiful opportunity to dispose of them once and for all.

 

[Aloïsius]

No drow in the PHB, I'm quite sure.
I still think some kind of large-like humanoid would be welcome. Powerful build could be rewritten for 4e with less problems because "abuse'" spells like polymorph are probably dealt with.

Another option would be some kind of centaure-like creature. A true centaure may be too strong and unpractical un dungeons, but what about a toned down wemic ? It can be the strong guy that seems lacking and have interesting rules because it's a quadruped. Just base it upon a cheetah (now claw attack !) rather than a lion.

Because we already have a hell-linked creature (Tiefling) and a Feywild one (Eladrin), what about something linked to the shadowfell ? It will fit nicely with the first adventure for 4e and the overalll "dark" feel of 4e. Probably "too much" because of the tieflings however.

 

[The Human Target]

Orc
Goblin
Warforged
Lizardfolk
Kobolds
Drow


Those are the likely choices if a hidden race is in fact one we have seen before.

I'm fine with all of them.

Though I'd like Kenku to be core, for the fun of it.

 

[GreatLemur]

I, too, would be really happy to see Orcs in the PHB.

Drow would be considerably less cool, especially since we've already got Elves, Half-Elves, and Eladrin. As has been observed, that's freaking elf overload, right there.

I've got kind of a worried feeling it might be some kind of goddamned furry, but even I have to admit I'd be cool with Lizardfolk or even Gnolls. Just not freaking Catfolk, please.

Aloïsius might have a point about including a Shadowfell-linked race. Damned if I know what that would be, though...

 

[Keefe the Thief]

Sorry? Did somebody upthread write that playing evil characters was wrong because either you learn too much about being evil or you suck at playing evil?

Anyway, it would be cool if a race like Gnoll or Lizardman would be reinterpreted as a PC race - most worlds could keep them as evil aggressors, but you´d have the option to play them in an entirely different context.

But if it´s orcs... well, i as an Eberron DM welcome our new Orc overlords.

 

[pawsplay]

I just don't see orcs working as a core PC race. In their current incarnation, they have a very high Str, whereas their balancing factor is basically their daylight sensitivity. Daylight sensitivity is hard to work for a PC race; either the party works around it, in which case it hardly matters, or they don't, in which case the orc underperforms a great deal of the time. And I can't see them stripping both traits; 4e seems to be working really hard to avoid diluting things.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

I just don't see orcs working as a core PC race. In their current incarnation, they have a very high Str, whereas their balancing factor is basically their daylight sensitivity. Daylight sensitivity is hard to work for a PC race; either the party works around it, in which case it hardly matters, or they don't, in which case the orc underperforms a great deal of the time. And I can't see them stripping both traits; 4e seems to be working really hard to avoid diluting things.

It's very likely 4e orcs won't be daylight sensitive.