AD&D First Edition inferior?

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Ah I don't care if they insult me. Most of the BB's I frequent are free for alls compared to this place. It's just jealousy of these massive biceps anyway. *flexes*

 

[Victim]

I'm not comparing this to 1e, and yes I would like to take out skills and feats. I would like to remove the whole, "I'll flank them for a +2 bonus then do a +5 power attack while I use my expertise for a +3 AC bonus, etc." I don't really want the combat that detailed, IME combat is a chore if you have several PC's battling several NPC's with classes. Too many mods to keep track of. The lack of skills is no problem, we just roleplay it and I'll take the PC's relevent stat into account to decide the result. There are plenty of good things I like about 3e, but the feat and combat system isn't one of them.

You mean situational modifiers like weapon versus armor mods, shieldless attacks, back attacks, etc. The modifiers that 1e hade for combat position are more complicated than +2 flanking.

 

[Numion]

FWIW, I've DMed two 3e campaigns to levels 16+ without any miniatures or battlemats. So claiming that those would be needed is just wrong. It just depends on your playing style. If the players trust their DM, there's no need to argue his rulings with miniature positions or battlemats. DM says you get an AoO, then you get AoO.

I don't see how 1e's situation of having no rules for something is any better than 3e's. In both cases the DMs word is final. 3e just gives more guidelines for the DM, if he should need them. I'm happy to have neat mechanics for most things, so I enjoy 3e. I can concentrate on more essential things than rules.

I wouldn't find 1e's unclear rules as a good basis for the claimed DMs freedom. In a sense it gives you freedom to make stuff up, and one doesn't really need rules for that.

 

[Theuderic]

Maybe you just aren't as good at gaming as you think?

This either implies a lack of tact or rudeness. Which one I wonder......

 

[rounser]

But if you are trying to snag a new audience, they need something familar looking.

Cosmetics, eh? Put a detachable wilderness hex map in the back, then, backed by a dungeon map, and make that look like a board. Attach dice and a bunch of 15mm brightly coloured plastic minis to the hardback, somehow. There's your board and counters. Incidentally, the Tales of the Lance map looked a lot like a boardgame board, but because it was a boxed set you couldn't see that.

For the most part, boardgames are limited by the edge of the board, which is anathema to one of D&D's main selling points - an opportunity to exercise creativity and the promise of nearly unlimited possibilities. Even Hero Quest and Advanced Hero Quest fall victim to this - they're inconvenient to expand because they need props. These limitations make games like Dungeon, Dragon Strike and the D&D Adventure Game fairly unmemorable, and the oD&D Basic red box a lot more appealing to the creative newcomer to the game once they buy the thing and introduce their friends to it.