Alternative HP systems and other altered d20 mechanics

[MutantHamster]

I got to thinking about what that guy siad about HP not being good. And I have to agree, HP is kindof not very good. The way more and more HD is added at each level makes the hp go way and way up and yet the con stays the same, but the too are directly related. Like your getting tougher without getting bonuses to the other attributes it should affect, like say fortitude saves. I just dont see how even killing a dragon, or a chaos lord could raise your physical fortitude to the point where you could get hit by like 5 boulders and not die.

With the current system, characters get way too strong. 1 5th level fighter could survive getting hit by 10 arrows. I mean, they may be arrows but isnt that a little extreme?

Now, I thought about what the dude said about relating ability points and hp, wich is probaly the best idea ive heard so far. But if you did that, say 10 hp = -1 constituion, you'd have to link advancement in hp and ability points. otherwise you'd run out of hp too fast. Unless you just use HP as some abstract counting system that started at 0, like subdual damage. Or if your Hp was Con x 10, but then, all the damage would be out of whack and super weak, since an average first elvel char would have 100 hp.

I hope you find the rules I presented, and feel free to share other rules, on maybe AC or something.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi there!

I have four pet hates with regards D&D mechanics:

1) Hit Points

Hit Points are certainly not perfect, personally I prefer the wound system from the original Star Wars RPG (not sure if they still use that).

For one, Hit Points don't really take into account the effect of injuries.

2) Armour

Armour should reduce damage not increase the difficulty to hit.

Monte Cook already mentioned (during one of the recent chat nights) he wanted to do this. D20 Modern and others are going in that direction.

3) Strength

Strength is idiotic in D&D - specifically the relationship between damage and lifting capacity. Something that could effectively lift planet Earth only has 412 strength - dealing +206 damage.

This leads us on to #4

4) Skill

The worst feature of D&D is whereby Hit Dice equals Skill (as in Basic Attack Bonus). Larger more powerful creatures have slower reflexes.

If anything Skill/BAB should parallel Dexterity; and as you increase Strength you should reduce Dexterity.

Take the Lord of the Rings movie. Remember the fight with the Giant Troll. The beast was clumsy but could soak up tremendous amounts of damage. Any humanoid hit by its attacks was pretty much guaranteed to die. The Hill Giant in the MM is probably the best parallel.

Anyone fighting a Hill Giant should rarely get hit (Its attacks are clumsy and slow); but when they do it should be pretty much game over!

 

[MutantHamster]

WHAT! How do you get decreasing dexterity from strenght? Dexterity is physical and motor skills. Getting more massive wont make you less coordinated, and usually doesnt make you much slower if its muscle mass. And btw: A big troll like that would have BAB penalties, because of its size. If it were huge it would get minus 2 to BAB and AC (wich is kindof an understatement)

 

[MutantHamster]

Ok i'm gonna make some d20 Rules With alot of stuff changed and I'll see if you like them! BobaloO!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi there!

WHAT!

Well firstly I am just thinking out loud!

How do you get decreasing dexterity from strenght? Dexterity is physical and motor skills.

I agree. Dexterity may need to be split into Skill and Speed - or somesuch for this precedent to work?

Getting more massive wont make you less coordinated,

I was implying comparatively (given size increases).

and usually doesnt make you much slower if its muscle mass.

I agree.

And btw: A big troll like that would have BAB penalties, because of its size. If it were huge it would get minus 2 to BAB and AC (wich is kind of an understatement)

I agree this difference is understated - and in fact if increased would go some way towards rectifying some of the problem?

I like this idea.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello again!

Ok i'm gonna make some d20 Rules With alot of stuff changed and I'll see if you like them! BobaloO!

Okay.

 

[MutantHamster]

Yeah the size penalty for a fly is +8, giving it an effective ac of like 18, meaning a 1st level fighter could hit one with an arrow....

 

[Psion]

Just so you know, this probably goes in HOUSE RULES.

 

[MutantHamster]

And wich house rule? The "With the current system, characters get way too strong. 1 5th level fighter could survive getting hit by 10 arrows. I mean, they may be arrows but isnt that a little extreme?" Yeah i'm sure thats useful.

THis is a rant not a house rule! Anyway....

Another reason the troll would be able to hit you so good is because hi strength bonus helps him hit a smaller creature than him somehow. Effectively: His Ability to crush your armor better is being tested against his ability to hit a small target. In the end it all evens out, but I prefer realisim. Anyway when i make a new game, I'll post a link (in my sig) so some people wont get upset just for the sake of being upset.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi MutantHamster!

Yeah the size penalty for a fly is +8, giving it an effective ac of like 18, meaning a 1st level fighter could hit one with an arrow....

I definately think you are onto something here mate!?

Perhaps we could tie this into a proper strength increase?