D&D 5E Anti-insperation

[Lanliss]

Does anybody have a type of "anti-insperation" to be used when a player goes against their role badly? Not for a good cleric who killed someone, but for a LG cleric burning down an orphanage full of children. I am thinking of employing this soon, and would like some more opinions on the matter.

My plan for it is to be used when players go far against their established character. LG behaving like CE, Halfling who swore to never harm a dragon murdering a whole clutch of Dragon eggs, LE warlock saving children from a burning orphanage without a good reason(they were an orphan, and have a soft spot for them). When this kind of thing happens, I note that the player has a Black Inspiration Die. This can be employed at my leisure, within the session, to either cancel out a players inspiration die, or to provide a monster with advantage at a pivotal moment. As I said, this is only for the extremes, and would never be employed for the slight breaches of character (like a dumb barbarian solving the riddle).

Thoughts or improvements?

 

[psychophipps]

I wouldn't bother. There are all sorts of story-based ways to put the screws to them instead.

 

[Fedge123]

I love this stuff, let the Divine Wrath begin!

- a halfling loses his luck
- a cleric's healing spells just don't seem to work as well any more
- a PC's magic item goes from a plus to a curse
- a spellcasting focus withers and dies and needs to be replaced at the temple
- a sentient magic item turns on it's owner
- apply disadvantage to certain actions
etc.

Confession, prayer, atonement can cure these things and are good hooks for adventures to set things right again.

 

[SunGold]

This is why I don't bother with alignment. Players are gonna do what they wanna do.

A different way to handle it: ignore alignment, give them inspiration for roleplaying consistent, believable characters, and let the consequences for psychopathy be story-based. Burn down an orphanage? Here comes the pitchfork-bearing mob...

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

As a DM, I'm personally against this sort of heavy handed "your character wouldnt do this". They are the player, they decide what their character should do. People are not always consistent. I'd argue that the halfling probably didnt really care that much about the oath, was caught up in the moment, or changed his mind after new facts were presented. The warlock maybe just doesnt like seeing kids suffer (evil can be squeamish), had a flash of insight, or a moment of conscience/softness. Even Skeletor got caught up in the spirit of Christmas!

The only purpose alignment serves is a shorthand for a collection of traits, and it doesnt even do that well. If the myriad of alignment arguments over the years have taught us anything, its that no one really agrees on all points of it (in which case, what good is it as a shorthand?). It's a silly concept well past it's expiration date, and better replaced by bonds, traits and flaws which are already in 5E. Or, you know, nothing, like pretty much every other RPG has done. I don't need an alignment to know that my 1920's Call of Cthulhu character is greedy, respects self-made men, kind of racist and sexist, and looks out for the the elderly in the community. Or that my Vampire character was cowardly but savage if cornered, regretful of what he did to survive a Nazi death camp, deceitful and seeks peace and compromise to conflict. None of those are an alignment, but all tell me more than any 2 letters scribbled on a character sheet could hope to.

 

[Lanliss]

The LG/CE example was just a rough one, meaning a supposedly lawful good, like the cleric, behaving evil by burning down an orphanage. I see where you are coming from though.

 

[iserith]

Does anybody have a type of "anti-insperation" to be used when a player goes against their role badly? Not for a good cleric who killed someone, but for a LG cleric burning down an orphanage full of children. I am thinking of employing this soon, and would like some more opinions on the matter.

My plan for it is to be used when players go far against their established character. LG behaving like CE, Halfling who swore to never harm a dragon murdering a whole clutch of Dragon eggs, LE warlock saving children from a burning orphanage without a good reason(they were an orphan, and have a soft spot for them). When this kind of thing happens, I note that the player has a Black Inspiration Die. This can be employed at my leisure, within the session, to either cancel out a players inspiration die, or to provide a monster with advantage at a pivotal moment. As I said, this is only for the extremes, and would never be employed for the slight breaches of character (like a dumb barbarian solving the riddle).

Thoughts or improvements?

Whenever I consider a house rule or addition to the game, I think about what goal I'm trying to achieve by implementing it and think about any potential "side effects" it may have. What I like about Inspiration is that it rewards the behavior you want to see and does not reward (rather than penalize) the behavior you don't want to see. When confronted with behavior I don't want to see, I just communicate that to the player directly and seek compromise.

That said, "going against their established character" isn't a behavior I particularly care about, provided the player is still pursuing the goals of play (doing things that everyone finds fun and creating an exciting, memorable story). In fact, going against established character gets to the heart of character development - it means the character has changed in some way (hopefully) for well-considered reasons that arose during play. I don't think that portraying the same character from 1st to 20th level is any particularly big accomplishment worthy of reward. Showing the struggle and the change as an adventurer goes from plucky dungeon-delver to Big Damn Hero in a believable way is more challenging and more interesting. That is worthy of reward in my view.

In short, while your house rule on Inspiration may curb some behaviors you don't want to see, it would definitely feel like a penalty to me (the stick, rather than the carrot) and could disincentivize character development.

 

[CapnZapp]

It's inspiration and perspiration. No mixing.

 

[Cody C. Lewis]

As a DM, I'm personally against this sort of heavy handed "your character wouldnt do this". They are the player, they decide what their character should do. People are not always consistent. I'd argue that the halfling probably didnt really care that much about the oath, was caught up in the moment, or changed his mind after new facts were presented. The warlock maybe just doesnt like seeing kids suffer (evil can be squeamish), had a flash of insight, or a moment of conscience/softness. Even Skeletor got caught up in the spirit of Christmas!

The only purpose alignment serves is a shorthand for a collection of traits, and it doesnt even do that well. If the myriad of alignment arguments over the years have taught us anything, its that no one really agrees on all points of it (in which case, what good is it as a shorthand?). It's a silly concept well past it's expiration date, and better replaced by bonds, traits and flaws which are already in 5E. Or, you know, nothing, like pretty much every other RPG has done. I don't need an alignment to know that my 1920's Call of Cthulhu character is greedy, respects self-made men, kind of racist and sexist, and looks out for the the elderly in the community. Or that my Vampire character was cowardly but savage if cornered, regretful of what he did to survive a Nazi death camp, deceitful and seeks peace and compromise to conflict. None of those are an alignment, but all tell me more than any 2 letters scribbled on a character sheet could hope to.

After reading this, I am completely convinced that I am going to do away with alignment moving forward.

I always just though of alignment as like a brief guide if you will, almost as like a baseline when coming up with a new character, never a hard line drawn in the sand. I couldn't even tell you what my players' characters' alignment is right now if I wanted.

I'm done. I think you're right. I can't believe I have been DMing for over a decade and like flipping a switch, you have convinced me just like that. Alignments don't do a single thing to enhance any of my games.

As for the OP. Consequences > punishing your players.