D&D 5E Beholders, concentration, antimagic fields

[FormerlyHemlock]

The Beholder seems particularly vulnerable to a few powerful priest spells:

Freedom of Movement (level 4, no concentration, negates paralyzing, slowing, telekinetic, and petrification rays)
Protection from Evil (level 1, concentration, negates charm and fear rays)
Bless (level 1, concentration, bolsters resistance to all rays)

If most of the party is covered by FOM, there isn't much the beholder can do about it. If he covers them with his anti-magic cone, his eye rays won't work. With PFE also, the beholder only has a 40% chance for any given eye ray to work! His priority should be taking on the PFE or Bless casters, to kill them or get them to break concentration (he might not be able to tell who cast which spell though), but even so his rays only have a 40% chance of even affecting that character. So my question is:

Can he project his anti-magic cone onto spellcasters concentrating on PFE and Bless, suppress the spells, and blast his eye rays at the rest of the party outside of the cone? I would say no based on strict RAW, but it does seem counter-intuitive considering that you cannot cast a spell out of an antimagic field from within an antimagic field.

Even simpler: replace all of those priest spells with a single Darkness spell. Beholder eye-rays only work on creatures they can see.

 

[flametitan]

Even simpler: replace all of those priest spells with a single Darkness spell. Beholder eye-rays only work on creatures they can see.

Unless you've got some schmuck keeping in melee/grappling the beholder (which isn't the worst idea, as the Bite isn't that great of a fallback attack, especially at disadvantage) the beholder can just... float out of the darkness. Remember its movement speed is larger than the radius of the darkness spell. And beholder lairs are designed specifically so that the beholder has the most freedom of movement relative to humanoid targets.

EDIT: I also think the freedom of movement spell isn't complete immunity from the petrifying ray. It prevents the initial restraining, but you're still being turned to stone.

As to the original question, I'm pretty sure the cone only affects the beholder shooting *into* the cone, as when choosing the point of origin for a cone or cube effect, you can choose whether or not the point itself is affected by it. The beholder would naturally choose not to include itself in the aoe.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Unless you've got some schmuck keeping in melee/grappling the beholder (which isn't the worst idea, as the Bite isn't that great of a fallback attack, especially at disadvantage) the beholder can just... float out of the darkness. Remember its movement speed is larger than the radius of the darkness spell. And beholder lairs are designed specifically so that the beholder has the most freedom of movement relative to humanoid targets.

And that helps... how? It still can't see the PCs who are inside the darkness, according to the 5E ruleset. They are still heavily obscured, and therefore ineligible targets for eye-rays.

 

[Ristamar]

That is an interesting idea. I hadn't thought of anti-magic field vs. concentration spells (whether being in the field automatically breaks concentration). I will have to think on that some more (probably while this turns into a 20 page thread with 3 spin offs as people argue whether WotC forgot about concentration when bringing the AMF into 5e, didn't forget and concentration isn't affected, and/or didn't forget but left it unclear so DM's could rule as they pleased).

Antimagic Field has no effect on concentration.

http://www.sageadvice.eu/2016/06/14/how-do-you-rule-concentration-in-an-antimagic-field/

 

[flametitan]

And that helps... how? It still can't see the PCs who are inside the darkness, according to the 5E ruleset. They are still heavily obscured, and therefore ineligible targets for eye-rays.

My mistake. I was under the impression you dropped it on top of the beholder.

Still, you've now basically forced disadvantage on everyone but the warlock, and the beholder can still just... float away to fight another day. Or, the beholder can hide, forcing the players to guess where it is, and simply wait for the spell to end.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

Won't the darkness go away if the beholder looks at it with it's central antimagic eye. It's a magical effect and won't exist in an antimagic zone.

Also to this.

Can he project his anti-magic cone onto spellcasters concentrating on PFE and Bless, suppress the spells, and blast his eye rays at the rest of the party outside of the cone? I would say no based on strict RAW, but it does seem counter-intuitive considering that you cannot cast a spell out of an antimagic field from within an antimagic field.

The beholder can lock down spell casters buffing the party with the central eye then shoot party members outside the antimagic zone with it's eye rays.

 

[flametitan]

Won't the darkness go away if the beholder looks at it with it's central antimagic eye. It's a magical effect and won't exist in an antimagic zone.

I think the idea is that if the beholder uses its antimagic to affect the darkness, then it can't eye beam into the party, but if it turns off its antimagic, then the darkness reappears to prevent it from eyebeaming the party.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

My mistake. I was under the impression you dropped it on top of the beholder.

Still, you've now basically forced disadvantage on everyone but the warlock, and the beholder can still just... float away to fight another day. Or, the beholder can hide, forcing the players to guess where it is, and simply wait for the spell to end.

(1) Darkness isn't opaque. It's heavy obscurement by RAW, which means you get advantage, not disadvantage, since the beholder can't see you and you can see it.

(2) Even if the DM controversially rules that the Darkness is opaque and blinds the creatures within it (for historical reasons, 2nd edition precedent, etc.), it still can't see you, so no disadvantage because advantage + disadvantage = nothing.

(3) The beholder floats away reaaaally slowly while being peppered by arrows from the archers in the party, plus the wizard's crossbow and maybe a few Lightning Bolts or something. Even in the most favorable terrain, it will be lucky to escape with half its HP intact.

(4) If the beholder floats away, it's surrendering the tactical initiative. A beholder which is forced to flee is a beholder which is half-defeated already.

(5) A Large-sized beholder which hides using its pathetic +2 to Stealth and 20' flying speed will not stay hidden long from a party of PCs who are proficient or better in Perception. Be serious.

 

[KahlessNestor]

That Sage Advice ruling sounds off to me. What exactly is Concentration then, if not maintaining some sort of magical conduit? I mean, summoned effects disappear.

I would rule it doesn't break concentration, but suppresses it. So if you move out of the AMF, the spells pop back up, and you still make saves if you take damage in the field.

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[Faenor]

Anti magic field. Not anti concentration field. Duration lasts until concentration is broken, but effect is suppressed by amf. The wording and the ruling are very consistent.