Can I run D&D as a DM with the DMG and MM?

[Charles Dunwoody]

This being the internet I want to be clear that I am not trying to stir up trouble, I'm really looking for answers from those DMs playing 4E now. I played 4E through the PH 2 and MM 2 and liked the heroic tier but not paragon (beholder was not fun).

Could I run D&D now with the DMG and MM without a DDI subscription? I mean a real campaign where I let in players with most of the books (Essentials, PH 2, not sure about PH 3 as I don't have).

Would I have the rules I need to play and would still I understand the game? Could I teach brand new players how to play? 'Cause at first I thought I wouldn't be able to run D&D anymore but I've read enough threads now saying Essentials is just another PH or Complete book so maybe I can?

Thanks for any help, I just don't know enough about latest rules and DDI stuff to be able to know the answer.

 

[jbear]

Of course you could. Rules are just a start to guide you to create the game you want to run.

I would suggest however running a game with the Rules COmpendium and the Monster Vault. Or at least make sure you know how to update the Monster Manual creatures dmg with the correct damge values.

 

[Nullzone]

Most of the core rules really haven't changed a lot that I'm aware, so yeah you definitely could run a game. Most errata applies to player options. At the very least, you could look over the published errata for the DMG (this information is free) and see if anything sticks out that you should keep track of.

For the MM, the only major change is the monster damage expressions published in MM3 and beyond; an easy way to get around this is to use the chart on SlyFlourish.com to supplement your toolset, but even then it's not a huge change at heroic levels, so either way you're good to go for a good 10-15 level span.

 

[SparqMan]

As long as you (and your players) don't mind you taking a little extra time to become familiar with whatever new stuff they bring to the table, you can totally do it.

 

[[OMENRPG]Ben]

I think it is the tendency for a lot of experienced DMs to stray farther and farther from the books, at least in my first hand experience. In fact, eventually the rules for monster creation and skill DCs becomes second nature and it is easy to play without any books at all.

Also, if you are starting a new campaign, you can make it more "classic" or more "gritty" and have less frequency of monsters and more story or involvement with fighting humans.

But, consider it a creative exercise, should be fun.

 

[S'mon]

You certainly could, you certainly don't need DDI. MM + MM2 is adequate, but MM3 and Monster Vault are worth getting if you have the cash. MM monsters need to do around +0.5 more damage per level to function.

 

[DracoSuave]

You absolutely can.

I remember taking the original three books, playing and running it, and it worked just fine.

Sure, some math nerds will tell you the math is off or some nonsense, but the honest truth is... it works just fine, you can do it, and you don't need to do a damn thing to make it work.

Granted, the updates have made it better... but that's not your question. The game was playable out of the original box. Therefore it is still playable today... unless some magic wizard came along and made it so using fairy dust and unicorn horns.

Seeing as none of that exists, knock yourself out, and have fun.

 

[Pentius]

You'll be fine. I'd download the errata updates, if you care about them. The only important thing I can think is that if a player wants to use material in a book you don't own, get them to show it you, so you know what you're dealing with.

 

[Riastlin]

As others have said, there's no problem running with just the MM and DMG. Essentials is perfectly compatible with "classic" 4ed. I am running one game and playing in another where we have both classic and essentials characters, etc.

MM1 monsters are generally notably weaker than later monsters, particularly if your players are accessing the full range of options, but even then you can still use the MM and challenge your players. Either you update the damage (which is fairly easy to do) or you just throw more critters at them (which effectively ups the damage as well).

The key is that no one set of monsters or "rules" for encounter creation works for every group. Some groups need a level +2 encounter to feel challenged while others are challenged perfectly well with an equal level encounter. Just keep an eye on how well your party is doing and adjust as needed. Plus, after a few levels, you'll start to get the hang of it and will be able to adjust monsters on your own or even create your own to throw at the party without much difficulty.

 

[Ferghis]

Yes, you can.

Personally, I'd prefer the Compendium and a D&Di subscription, but you're absolutely fine. If you don't use the updated monster damage values, your monsters will be a bit weak: a good match will be PC level+3, assuming moderately optimized characters. The old version of the brute has too many HP, so I'd use them sparingly, unless you want really long fights.