Clark Peterson on 4E

[GMforPowergamers]

I have been a big fan of Necromancer for a while now. Necro, Goodmen, and a few others have been a great throw back to 1e...

I also LOVE 4e...anime and all.

I think Clark saying "Anime crap" was about right for his way of thinking. I would probly not be into his stuff. I like 1e fel, 2e feel, 3efeel, and 4e feel. I want to have rules to support of of them. I also (No offence ment) think clark is a step back, not a step forward. I think WotC is the next wave.

I hope to god that all of those steps back are there but that there is still forward motion.

Clark: You go on doing what you do, and saying what you think. You shouldn't have to be held to a higherr standard then anyone else on these or your own board...

 

[Halivar]

Meh. I just pretend that when he says, "anime crap," he really means "crappy anime," and his only desire is to keep people from making characters from Slayers or Hand-Maid May, which I consider a noble endeavor.

</sort-of-sarcasm-because-im-sick-of-my-gaming-group-doing-exactly-this>

 

[Connorsrpg]

OK, this is more for those that have written D&D products and are posting here. (Namely Orcus, Darrin ... and maybe cperkins (though I am not sure whether this is the one that wrote for Wizards)).

I play and mostly DM 4E. Have done every edition. Pretty much feel each has been an improvement.

I too question the abilities of the characters (esp at low levels). I have often had a gritty DM style, but the players seem to love it. I have several issues (as does Orcus, but still love the game, as does Orcus).

What I really want a response on is: "From the DM's perspective, isn't 4E more like 1E than ever before"?

I have found it so. 1E & 2E adventures translate much easier into 4E than 3E. Creature design and more 'free-calls' on the DM's part certainly add to that feeling to me.

Your thoughts?

BTW: Sorry to see such a good writer in Darrin turn away from the game. I liked a lot of his work, esp Exalted Deeds

 

[Korgoth]

Meh. I just pretend that when he says, "anime crap," he really means "crappy anime," and his only desire is to keep people from making characters from Slayers or Hand-Maid May, which I consider a noble endeavor.

</sort-of-sarcasm-because-im-sick-of-my-gaming-group-doing-exactly-this>

I think the anime fans around here can be a bit thin-skinned. There are some anime films that I like. But it would be disingenous to deny that there are a gazillion anime films in which people jump 40 feet in the air, throw a hundred attacks in two seconds, demolish entire buildings with one attack, dodge and fly around like they're in a wire-fu movie, produce giant mallets out of thin air (and put them back...), punch through walls and generally perpetrate deeds of outrageous over-the-top action. In fact, the anime films in which none of the above happen are probably in the minority.

That doesn't mean they're not out there, or that they're not good by association, or that there's anything wrong with an indulgence in mindless action in your viewing tastes, etc. But people associate anime with ridiculomegamondoultrahuge-o action the way they associate westerns with gun fights and love stories with kissing. Sure, there are anime films that don't have that, but there are so many that do that you can hardly get too offended by the association.

 

[Keefe the Thief]

Even if powerful stuff happens in anime, using the term as an equivalent to "i don´t like this overpowered childish stuff" is insulting. Let´s be honest: It´s like using "D&D players " as an equivalent to "nerd who lives in his parent´s garage."

 

[Fenes]

We have a winner.

Cirno...enough already. Your post before the one I just quoted begins with
"Like I said already...", and yet you proceed to repeat yourself. And then repeat yourself. Again.

Yada, yada, yada...blah blah blah...we get it. Really, we do. You are upset that some people were angry when they thought Clark was anti-4e.

He's not.

They were wrong.

You have always possessed punctilious courtesy on the boards.

End of story.

Move on.

To distill it even further:

(1) The man admittedly loves 4e.
(2) The man wants to make 4e better.
(3) Most agree with (1) and are perfectly fine with someone trying (2).
(4) Everyone wins.

Good night.

WP

It's not the prof who needs to move on, it's the people he spoke of, jumping on every (imagined) critic of 4E (and 3E) who need to move on, and finally accept that not everyone likes the same things they like.

 

[Fenes]

Even if powerful stuff happens in anime, using the term as an equivalent to "i don´t like this overpowered childish stuff" is insulting. Let´s be honest: It´s like using "D&D players " as an equivalent to "nerd who lives in his parent´s garage."

As was mentioned, "Record of Loddoss Wars" is anime, and still the best movie/TV series about D&D ever made.

People just need to finally understand that anime is a medium, like comics or movies, not a distinct style. (And all they need is to replace "anime" with "(fill in the one example of an anime movie/series you see as negative)".

 

[ProfessorCirno]

We have a winner.

Cirno...enough already. Your post before the one I just quoted begins with
"Like I said already...", and yet you proceed to repeat yourself. And then repeat yourself. Again.

Yada, yada, yada...blah blah blah...we get it. Really, we do. You are upset that some people were angry when they thought Clark was anti-4e.

He's not.

They were wrong.

You have always possessed punctilious courtesy on the boards.

End of story.

Move on.

To distill it even further:

(1) The man admittedly loves 4e.
(2) The man wants to make 4e better.
(3) Most agree with (1) and are perfectly fine with someone trying (2).
(4) Everyone wins.

Good night.

WP

And yet, despite you saying that, even now, in this very thread, people are still throwing temper tantrums that Clark has the audacity to claim he can improve 4e in ways they dislike.

So uh...well, there goes that, I suppose.

 

[Kishin]

Clark -

The sad fact is, regardless of how well worded you made your statement, there would have still been people here who would've gotten upset enough to attack you for it. There is, depressingly enough, a group of people on these forums that takes any joke about 4e, or event he thought that 4e could be improved, as a personal insult.

I seriously think the only person who takes these things quite so personally is you, given your posting habits.

[/quote=Orcus]
You are right. I COULD just close my eyes and say "its just like shooting twice, its just like shooting twice, dont let it bother you." But in a way it isnt. Just ignoring the fluff to me isnt he answer. I agree I could. Here is why I dont like to just ignore it:

First off, because that isnt what it is--it is in fact the ability to fire two arrows at once and have them hit different targets. That, to me, represents a greater shift to the fantastical than I like in my game. I agree, that is a personal preference. And this isnt a tenth level guy, its a first level guy.[/quote]

But the fluff is what marks it as 'the ability to fire two arrows at once'. D&D round are not one instantaneous moment.

Still, they say write what you know, and if that's not the game reality you know Clark, then you've got to do your things your way. Yeah, I'm a little confused to see the 180, but you can't make someone be disengenuous in their creative output. Well, you can, but usually it involves large amounts of money and members of the opposite sex, neither of which are generally showered on third party RPG publishers, however deserving they may be.

Also, don't forget that AD&D allows a triple rate of fire for ready missile weapons during surprise (DMG pg 62)*. Bows + surprise rock in AD&D.

The reality of this actually resulted in the only PC death I have witnessed wherein the PC did not even have a chance to introduce himself to the party properly. He has achieved legendary red shirt status.

He was a replacement for that player's other recently deceased PC too....Kid has no luck...

In our defense, we were young and foolish.

 

[ProfessorCirno]

I seriously think the only person who takes these things quite so personally is you, given your posting habits.

You kidding? I find this hilarious. Just take it easy, man. Yukkuri shiteitte ne! and all that nonesense.