Converting the Dukes of Hell

[Shade]

MOVE: 12”/30” (in crow form)

Malphas appears as a powerful, dark-complexioned man dressed in black velvet studded with gems (of considerable value; his robes have 333 gems of all sorts, 100 g.p. base value each, if recovered complete), or as a large, black, crow-like bird.

Not much detail on the crow form. He can apparently fly at a speed of 80 feet.

When they say "large, black, crow-like bird", do you think that means large in the size category sense, or simply "a big normal bird"?

If the former, we could use the stats for the giant raven from Frostburn. Otherwise, we can go with the normal raven stats in the MM. Neither form flies that fast, though. Alternatively, we could use the stats for a giant eagle (which does fly at 80 feet) for simplicity's sake.

There's always the option of allowing to take the form of raven of either size, too.

 

[Kain Darkwind]

Not much detail on the crow form. He can apparently fly at a speed of 80 feet.

When they say "large, black, crow-like bird", do you think that means large in the size category sense, or simply "a big normal bird"?

If the former, we could use the stats for the giant raven from Frostburn. Otherwise, we can go with the normal raven stats in the MM. Neither form flies that fast, though. Alternatively, we could use the stats for a giant eagle (which does fly at 80 feet) for simplicity's sake.

There's always the option of allowing to take the form of raven of either size, too.

When we did Malphas for Gates of Hell, we sort of incorporated crow/raven traits into his normal form. Sort of, but not quite fully, an anthropomorphic raven. Almost all of those old devils were taken from real life religious myth, and had bizzare forms. So I guess I'm sort of suggesting, drop the crow as an alternate form and work it into his physical description.

On the other hand, I think using the giant eagle would be the best route if you were set on the crow form. It has the advantage of speed AND being core SRD.

 

[Aspect of BOZ]

Not much detail on the crow form. He can apparently fly at a speed of 80 feet.

When they say "large, black, crow-like bird", do you think that means large in the size category sense, or simply "a big normal bird"?

If the former, we could use the stats for the giant raven from Frostburn. Otherwise, we can go with the normal raven stats in the MM. Neither form flies that fast, though. Alternatively, we could use the stats for a giant eagle (which does fly at 80 feet) for simplicity's sake.

There's always the option of allowing to take the form of raven of either size, too.

for the sake of reference, back then you really only had three size categories: S, M, and L. M (which was "man-sized" rather than Medium) was 5-7' tall and within the approximate build and mass of a human. S meant smaller than that, and L meant larger than that.

however, in this case, i'm inclined to think that they simply mean "larger than a normal crow". i'm thinking to make him a Medium sized bird, and maybe a 7-foot tall humanoid.

should we go with Alternate Form or Change Shape?

Alternate Form: quasit, imp, dragon (bronze, gold, silver), eladrins, lycanthropes, phasm

Change Shape: aranea, hound archon, barghest, doppelganger, rakshasa, slaad (green, gray, death)

note that what creature(s) we copy from isn't all that important, because Mal won't have the exact same stats in that form anyway. rather than say that he has the stats of a giant raven (for example), it's more like he has his own normal stats but borrows a few abilities in his other form.

When we did Malphas for Gates of Hell, we sort of incorporated crow/raven traits into his normal form. Sort of, but not quite fully, an anthropomorphic raven. Almost all of those old devils were taken from real life religious myth, and had bizzare forms. So I guess I'm sort of suggesting, drop the crow as an alternate form and work it into his physical description.

nah, i'll leave reimaging/reinventing these guys up to you guys at DF. to keep it easy on myself, i just stick with reinterpreting the D&D material. getting results using different methods means that DMs can choose which version suits them better - or they can create their own version which may be an amalgam of the two or none of the above.

 

[Shade]

I'd go with alternate form. Change shape seems to most often be used for changing into multiple possible forms (Small humanoids) as opposed to a more specific, same-form-every-time change.

 

[Kain Darkwind]

I'd go with alternate form. Change shape seems to most often be used for changing into multiple possible forms (Small humanoids) as opposed to a more specific, same-form-every-time change.

I agree with alternate form here for the ability over change shape, for the exact reason Shade mentions. And I didn't think about him keeping his same stats in the form. Oops.

 

[Aspect of BOZ]

cool. his alternate form power will undoubtedly be a lot simpler than Amdu's for 2 reasons: 1), he only has one other form, and 2) he has a lot fewer powers.

in fact - is there anything we need to worry about other than him not using weapons as a raven, and being able to fly in raven form? is there anything else we want to carry over besides flight speed? maybe a vision-related power?

Alternate Form (Su): Malphas can shift between his humanoid and raven forms as a standard action. In humanoid form, he cannot use his ... abilities, but he can use ... and can use weapons.

In raven form, he cannot use his ... abilities or make weapon attacks, but he can use ... and his fly speed is 80 feet (16 squares).

Malphas remains in one form until he chooses to assume a new one. A change in form cannot be dispelled, nor does Malphas revert to any particular form when killed. A true seeing spell reveals all forms simultaneously.

 

[Shade]

Well, normal ravens get nothing special.

Giant ravens get evasion and a +4 racial bonus on Spot checks during daylight hours.

I'm not sure if he really needs that, though.

 

[Kain Darkwind]

cool. his alternate form power will undoubtedly be a lot simpler than Amdu's for 2 reasons: 1), he only has one other form, and 2) he has a lot fewer powers.

in fact - is there anything we need to worry about other than him not using weapons as a raven, and being able to fly in raven form? is there anything else we want to carry over besides flight speed? maybe a vision-related power?

Alternate Form (Su): Malphas can shift between his humanoid and raven forms as a standard action. In humanoid form, he cannot use his ... abilities, but he can use ... and can use weapons.

In raven form, he cannot use his ... abilities or make weapon attacks, but he can use ... and his fly speed is 80 feet (16 squares).

Malphas remains in one form until he chooses to assume a new one. A change in form cannot be dispelled, nor does Malphas revert to any particular form when killed. A true seeing spell reveals all forms simultaneously.

I would say that in humanoid form, he can only use weapons and the natural attacks of that form (if any).

In raven form, he can only use the natural attacks of the raven form. He can fly in raven form.

In either form, he can use his spell-like abilities. (Does he have any supernatural/special attack forms that we're giving him that don't make sense for a raven form to use? His fear attack seems fine for a raven to use....the birds are often described as unsettling)

True seeing should reveal 'both' forms, since there are only two.

 

[BOZ]

so just claw/claw/bite in raven form?

yeah, his SLAs and fear touch should work fine in either form, as would summoning i'd imagine. unlike Amduscias, i don't see any abilities (besides attacks) that wouldn't work equally well in both forms.

 

[BOZ]

so, with an Int of 24, he gets 420 skill ranks, maaaan...

I bolded the common skills I think he'd most use:

Appraise = mid to high ranks
Balance = low to mid ranks when used
Bluff = usually max ranks
Climb = high to max ranks when used
Concentration = mid to high ranks
Diplomacy = usually max ranks
Disguise = high ranks or synergy only
Escape Artist = few ranks
Gather Information = mid to high ranks when used
Hide = mid to high ranks
Intimidate = high to max ranks
Jump = mid to high ranks
Knowledge (arcana) = high to max ranks
Knowledge (history) = high to max ranks
Knowledge (nobility and royalty) = high to max ranks
Knowledge (religion) = high to max ranks
Knowledge (the planes) = high to max ranks
Listen = high to max ranks
Move Silently = mid to high ranks
Search = mid to high ranks
Sense Motive = high to max ranks
Spellcraft = high to max ranks
Spot = high to max ranks
Survival = synergy only
Tumble = high to max ranks
Use Rope = synergy only

OK, so how about Appraise, Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Disguise, Escape Artist, Gather Information, Hide, Intimidate, Knowledge (at least two), Listen, Move Silently, Search, Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Spot, and Tumble?