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D&D and the rising pandemic

Here is a NYT article listing approved N95/KN95 masks and sellers:


I'm super annoyed that the first of these did not pop up on a search for N95's on Amazon, even though its right there when you follow that link. :p

Edit: And it turns out if you try to buy those, they aren't actually available.
 
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FitzTheRuke

Legend
Man, I really can't get tested here. I've been looking into it all day. You're pretty much locked out if you don't have an "in" in the medical community. I mean, I get it, testing is overtaxed, but it's going to be mighty hard on my small business, which would be a shame to have to happen if I don't have covid. These "home tests" that everyone talks about don't seem to be a thing here.
 

Hussar

Legend
It's so weird.

I've never even seen an n-95 mask here. No one wears them. Just the regular paper masks most of the time, with some folks using cloth masks.

Actually, I tell a lie. I did actually see a box of kn-95 (I assume that's the same) at the store the other day. Never worn one and never seen one worn by any of my students, but, it doesn't seem to be all that necessary.

But, as far as "Oh, I'm not going to be around people goes," here, walking at 6:30 in the morning, pretty much no people around, I still see every other walker - people walking their dogs or like me out for a walk before work - and 100% of these people are masked.

AFAIK, there's no such thing as "Oh, it's okay to not mask". It just doesn't exist. Here you might as well say, "Oh, it's okay to walk around without pants". It just doesn't happen.
 

Actually, I tell a lie. I did actually see a box of kn-95 (I assume that's the same) at the store the other day. Never worn one and never seen one worn by any of my students, but, it doesn't seem to be all that necessary.

They're not quite the same. The KN-95 is the Chinese standard; the N-95 is the U.S. standard. I forget the exact difference bet they're pretty close.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
But, as far as "Oh, I'm not going to be around people goes," here, walking at 6:30 in the morning, pretty much no people around, I still see every other walker - people walking their dogs or like me out for a walk before work - and 100% of these people are masked.

AFAIK, there's no such thing as "Oh, it's okay to not mask". It just doesn't exist. Here you might as well say, "Oh, it's okay to walk around without pants". It just doesn't happen.

Sure, as a cultural thing, that makes some sense. Everyone doing it always makes it a habit and supports compliance.

But, in terms of the science, there's no need to mask outdoors if you are more than about 10' from people. It isn't like smog that fills the outdoors air.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
They're not quite the same. The KN-95 is the Chinese standard; the N-95 is the U.S. standard. I forget the exact difference bet they're pretty close.

There are some small differences. Both are designed to filter out 95% of 0.3 micron particles, and for most people's use, they are equivalent.

1) The KN95 requires a fit test as part of the certification, meaning they have to put it on an human being, and demonstrate it has <8% leakage. The N95 does not make this fit test part of the standard.

2) The N95 has slightly stricter standards for pressure drop across the mask when inhaling and exhaling, so you might find an N95 more breathable.

3) The real practical issue is that there's TONS of counterfeit KN95s on the market, while there are few counterfeit N95s. KN95s are usually cheaper than N95s.
 

Zardnaar

Legend
NZ meme.
IMG-eb9ca680d119faa4a33ea55392854de8-V.png

Context NZs greatest comedian.
Sophisticated Weaponary
 

Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator
Staff member
There are some small differences. Both are designed to filter out 95% of 0.3 micron particles, and for most people's use, they are equivalent.

1) The KN95 requires a fit test as part of the certification, meaning they have to put it on an human being, and demonstrate it has <8% leakage. The N95 does not make this fit test part of the standard.

2) The N95 has slightly stricter standards for pressure drop across the mask when inhaling and exhaling, so you might find an N95 more breathable.

3) The real practical issue is that there's TONS of counterfeit KN95s on the market, while there are few counterfeit N95s. KN95s are usually cheaper than N95s.
Here’s a link for those who want a bit more detail:
 

Hussar

Legend
Sure, as a cultural thing, that makes some sense. Everyone doing it always makes it a habit and supports compliance.

But, in terms of the science, there's no need to mask outdoors if you are more than about 10' from people. It isn't like smog that fills the outdoors air.
That's the thing though - it's not about "need". It's about actually caring about other people. When it becomes a habit, then, there's no real need for enforcement.

And, let's be honest here, it's pretty effective.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
That's the thing though - it's not about "need". It's about actually caring about other people.

Eh. This is perhaps not the place for long discussions of the differences between a cultural tradition of caring, and a cultural tradition of compliance and abnegation. I'll just say that maybe that assertion would hold up better if the workplace suicide rate wasn't quite so high.

When it becomes a habit, then, there's no real need for enforcement.

And, let's be honest here, it's pretty effective.

No argument there. I just am not a fan of absolute social rules.
 

NotAYakk

Legend
Eh. This is perhaps not the place for long discussions of the differences between a cultural tradition of caring, and a cultural tradition of compliance and abnegation. I'll just say that maybe that assertion would hold up better if the workplace suicide rate wasn't quite so high.
The USA age standardized suicide rate is higher than Japan's. At least on Wikipedia.

And they are in a similar ballpark.

Japan's homicide rate is rounding error compared to suicide; not so much in the USA.
 
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Snarf Zagyg

Notorious Liquefactionist
The USA age standardized suicide rate is higher than Japan's. At least on Wikipedia.


See also-
"Japan's total numbers place it significantly outside the top 10, but suicide is nonetheless a serious concern there. Suicide is the leading cause of death in men between the ages of 20-44 and women between the ages of 15-34."

Looking at the numbers in isolation (just population) doesn't really do it justice given that Japan's population skews so old- it really is a crisis for the young.
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
The USA age standardized suicide rate is higher than Japan's. At least on Wikipedia.

Yeah, but I didn't claim we were a country of folks who cared about each other, either.

Japan's homicide rate is rounding error compared to.suicide; not so much in the USA.

I did not present the USA as a paragon of virtue here, so while knocking down the US on this may feel to you like it is knocking down my point, but you are attacking an unrelated strawman. Japan's workplace suicide rate is high enough to question whether it really has a culture of caring for one another, without any appearance of the US in the discussion.

And in this, we see why discussions go badly.
 

3) The real practical issue is that there's TONS of counterfeit KN95s on the market, while there are few counterfeit N95s. KN95s are usually cheaper than N95s.

Yeah, when I was searching I found a lot of KN95's, but looking at the reviews they all seemed dodgy.

The biggest complaint I saw about the few N95's I saw was that they seemed too small, which admittedly, as someone with a big head is a concern.
 

Cadence

Legend
Supporter
Working at my university (in the SE US), it feels odd/sad to read about the lack of tests. Faculty and students here could do pretty much an unlimited number of saliva tests with no waiting and get the results back by the next morning at latest. It's sad that folks in general don't even have a meaningful fraction of that support.
 

Cadence

Legend
Supporter
@Umbran (and anyone else who might know/speculate off the top of their head).

I was listening to an old radio drama where there was a fictional (I think) substance that was a contact poison in its powder form, but not when it was mixed in water. So the way to use it diabolically was to carry it around diluted, paint it on what your target would touch, and then be sure not to touch it yourself after it dried. This got me thinking about cloth masks that are worn for a long time or reused without sitting several days. So, the mask does what we're hoping it does and catches the droplet with the virus because the droplet is well above the minimum size. After the droplet dries, is the virus just sitting on the mask and capable of getting inhaled through?
 
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Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
Ugh.
Double vaxxed and boosted. Took all reasonable precautions. Had to take a required trip for work after Xmas.

… and just tested positive for the ‘rona. 2022, everybody!

(so far, it’s like a bad cold- one day of symptoms.)
Just saw this. Hope things are still mild(or better) for you. Get well soon.
 

Rabulias

Legend
@Umbran (and anyone else who might know/speculate off the top of their head).

I was listening to an old radio drama where there was a fictional (I think) substance that was a contact poison in its powder form, but not when it was mixed in water. So the way to use it diabolically was to carry it around diluted, paint it on what your target would touch, and then be sure not to touch it yourself after it dried. This got me thinking about cloth masks that are worn for a long time or reused without sitting several days. So, the mask does what we're hoping it does and catches the droplet with the virus because the droplet is well above the minimum size. After the droplet dries, is the virus just sitting on the mask and capable of getting inhaled through?
I am no expert at all, but I believe that if the mask fully dries, any virus on it will die. I don't think you have "dehydrated virus - just add water!"
 


Zardnaar

Legend

See also-
"Japan's total numbers place it significantly outside the top 10, but suicide is nonetheless a serious concern there. Suicide is the leading cause of death in men between the ages of 20-44 and women between the ages of 15-34."

Looking at the numbers in isolation (just population) doesn't really do it justice given that Japan's population skews so old- it really is a crisis for the young.

That's a cheery read. Thought my country would be bad as the media was sensationalizing it now they don't directly mention when it happens.
 

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