D&D Insider: Losing your toys

[Shroomy]

Heh. You think bugs and missing features unavoidable in any software? Well, there's a matter of degrees we're talking here. DDI has more missing features than actual features. So much so that it means charging the fanbase just to view an R&D article about how gnomes were handled in 4e. They're not even providing access to stuff just to maintain and generate interest for non-subscribers, and that's shabby. The major feature of a subscription-based service shouldn't be previews of material that the customer will ultimately wind up paying for at some point in the future. That's paying to beta test, and the fact that DDI does just that is telling.

Are you a DDI subscriber? Because judging from this post and the one below it, you are not, and you don't seem very familiar with the DDI or the free offerings on the WoTC website. For one thing, the PHB2 class previews were not the major feature of the DDI subscription service (the compendium, CB, and e-magazines are arguably the major, current features of the DDI), they're an extra bonus to subscribers. Also, those were completed classes, not playtest material; WoTC did not actively solicit feedback on them like they did for the artificer or barbarian playtests. And to your point, there have been four, count'em, four articles of playtest materials released so far in the DDI (the artificer, barbarian, AV2, and Primal Power), two of which were free. OMG, I feel so scammed, I wonder how I'll feel in two months when I get my hands on the playtest version of the monk. Oh yeah, pretty damn good, thank you very much.

And while the "Design & Development" article may have been a trifle (magazine and newspaper columns usually vary in content or interest anyways), "Deities & Demigods: Bane," "Playing Shadar-Kai," "Secrest of the City Entombed," and "Planar Epic Destinies" were definitely not. I pay $5/month for those articles (dirt cheap IMO), plus access to all of the other DDI services, which doesn't sound like the only thing WoTC is offering to subscribers is a puff piece on gnomes and half-orcs.

So, after all that, what does WoTC currently offer in terms of free materials, well let's take a look:

Podcasts
Art
Free Fiction
Multiple Excerpts from their Monthly Releases (including a new PHB2 preview)
RPGA News
"Steal this Hook"
"Vicious Venues"
"D&D Alumni"
"Previews and Beyond"
Compendium Demo
Fully Functional CB Demo covering materials from levels 1-3
Several free issues of 4e Dragon and Dungeon
Random other freebies (like the "Treasure of Talon Pass" adventure)

Yes, that is paltry.....

 

[Felon]

Are you a DDI subscriber? Because judging from this post and the one below it, you are not, and you don't seem very familiar with the DDI or the free offerings on the WoTC website. For one thing, the PHB2 class previews were not the major feature of the DDI subscription service (the compendium, CB, and e-magazines are arguably the major, current features of the DDI), they're an extra bonus to subscribers.

Not sure why you deem yourself fit to dictate what's a "major feature" versus what's an "extra bonus" (the PHB2 class previews certainly seem to constitute a "major feature" here in the forums, judging by discussion). Since it's all covered by the same fee, calling one item an "extra bonus" is, of course, the same kind of double-talk we're exposed to every day by advertisers. In this instance, it's a way to play down the double-billing effect of enticing people to buy something they're likely going to buy again in the future.

"See, DDI subscribers didn't actually pay for those previews--they were actually free! Bonus content! It's just that people who don't pay the fee don't get access to them."

To the person not paying the subscription, the distinction is rather moot, isn't it? There's a big chunk of the fanbase still alienated by the "you're in either in or out" approach.

If you're happy to pay for DDI, and proud declare it with utmost snark, bully for you, but I'm not sure what you think that's supposed to mean to me or anyone else.

 

[mudbunny]

Apparently, being a DDI subscriber means being unclear as to what is actually being included with that subscription. I say this because the sarcastic response above is undermined by the fact that the PHB previews (the sorcerer, invoker, etc) were in fact not free. This is not the first time I've had to poin this out, so I'm curious as to where the confusion stems from; the barbarian was free, but that came out right before DDI became a subscriber-only offering. Aside fromt the PHB2 previews, the rest of your inventory is padded with free fiction. Where's the free content for the actual game? That's what I go to the WotC website for, and by no coincedence that's the stuff they're charging for (along with lots of fluff pieces).

I am referring to the PHB 2 excerpts which, if you go to the DDI Editorial Calendar, are quite clearly marked as *free*, and I can read without being logged into DDI.

For example, Monday's PH2 excerpt is a teaser on Racial Paragon Paths, and includes a PP for humans, the Adroit Explorer.

Edit to add - The initial wording of my response was, in hindsight, far too snarky. My apologies to the ENWorld community.

 

[kibbitz]

Pardon? Did that make sense when you typed it? Because it doesn't really parse when I read it. Once I "pay" for something it's no longer "free", IMO. Do you feel differently somehow?

Prism covered what I meant, but yeah, I see the software as free. They're not charging us for the software, and anyone can download and install a copy on their systems (even without a subscription.) What is actually wanted/needed is the additional data for levels 4-30 not covered by the installer itself, as well as other rulebooks. And of course, the availability of this data for personal archival matters too.

Right now I'm considering paying $56, since I know I'll want the PHB2 rules, as well as the Arcane and Divine Power books. I might even renew for the next year depending on what rules previews are out in Feb '10.

--- snip ---

If (as a paying subscriber) WotC allowed me to download the "current ruleset" (whatever that means on a given day) as a ZIP file at any particular time so that I would point the demo installer at that file instead of WotC's server (or really any other solution that gets me the security I'm looking for) then I'd be happy as a clam and sign up today.

Well, my original point to Dire Bare was that I saw your argument as not being about the amount of money it's costing you for the CB, but how you want your CB from WotC. Which got me to wondering how much would 4e people pay for the CB if they sold it using a regular sales model.

 

[Shroomy]

Not sure why you deem yourself fit to dictate what's a "major feature" versus what's an "extra bonus" (the PHB2 class previews certainly seem to constitute a "major feature" here in the forums, judging by discussion). Since it's all covered by the same fee, calling one item an "extra bonus" is, of course, the same kind of double-talk we're exposed to every day by advertisers. In this instance, it's a way to play down the double-billing effect of enticing people to buy something they're likely going to buy again in the future.

"See, DDI subscribers didn't actually pay for those previews--they were actually free! Bonus content! It's just that people who don't pay the fee don't get access to them."

To the person not paying the subscription, the distinction is rather moot, isn't it? There's a big chunk of the fanbase still alienated by the "you're in either in or out" approach.

If you're happy to pay for DDI, and proud declare it with utmost snark, bully for you, but I'm not sure what you think that's supposed to mean to me or anyone else.

You make it sound like the previews are the only thing in the DDI, when that's far from the truth. Sure they generated lots of discussion on the messageboards (as would any major preview, especially for classes from older editions updated to 4e), but come on, you can't seriously claim that previews that will be superceded in a month somehow rank as a major feature of the DDI bundle when you compare them to the monthly magazine only content (whose proportion of page count by far outstrips the previews), the DDI Compendium, and especially the Character Builder.

While I realize that pennies out of my staggering $5/month fee goes towards subsidizing marketing previews of books I will be buying anyways, I really paid for all the other features, as well as the Flash Tools, when I signed up in October (technically, I signed up for the promise of CB), before there was any inkling of a major, subscriber-only PHB2 preview (at best, I expected another playtest article), and while they were nice, next month, those features will still have the same utility that the previews will now lack. Besides, there's no guarantee that there will be another preview next month (unlike more magazine content and updated software); in fact, I don't expect anything like the PHB2 previews until next winter (if at all), prior to the PHB3 release.

 

[Jack99]

Heh. You think bugs and missing features unavoidable in any software? Well, there's a matter of degrees we're talking here. DDI has more missing features than actual features. So much so that it means charging the fanbase just to view an R&D article about how gnomes were handled in 4e. They're not even providing access to stuff just to maintain and generate interest for non-subscribers, and that's shabby. The major feature of a subscription-based service shouldn't be previews of material that the customer will ultimately wind up paying for at some point in the future. That's paying to beta test, and the fact that DDI does just that is telling.

Not sure why you deem yourself fit to dictate what's a "major feature" versus what's an "extra bonus" (the PHB2 class previews certainly seem to constitute a "major feature" here in the forums, judging by discussion). Since it's all covered by the same fee, calling one item an "extra bonus" is, of course, the same kind of double-talk we're exposed to every day by advertisers. In this instance, it's a way to play down the double-billing effect of enticing people to buy something they're likely going to buy again in the future.

Please do note the irony of these two statements (bolded parts).

 

[darjr]

Felon, you do not get to decide, for others, what is worthwhile content and what isn't. IMHO the 'inside' information is really cool, and in fact, is appreciated by others. I think it's just fine if you think they are worse than no good. I don't agree.

 

[Felon]

Please do note the irony of these two statements (bolded parts).

Not sure where you're getting irony from. One thing says "this oughtn't be a major feature", and the other one says "currently, this sure seems to be a major feature". When the only intent in reading a post is to deconstruct it, context has a way of getting overlooked.

Felon, you do not get to decide, for others, what is worthwhile content and what isn't. IMHO the 'inside' information is really cool, and in fact, is appreciated by others. I think it's just fine if you think they are worse than no good. I don't agree.

Well, good for you. Am I engaging in any less of a degree of self-expression as all the folks who scream from the rafters how wonderful DDI is? Should you peddle the schoolmarm tone at them for dictating what's wonderful to others? And tell them you agree with them too, because it's quite important to post whenever you do or don't agree with someone?

I see DDI as representing a "loss of toys" for a good chunk of players and potential players. Oddly enough, I was one of the folks who held their tongue back in the day when so many others were getting all torch-and-pitchforky at WotC for axing Paizo. Now, in true fairweather fickle fashion, the status quo has been embraced and dissent is seen as dictatorial.

 

[Asmor]

Not sure where you're getting irony from. One thing says "this oughtn't be a major feature", and the other one says "currently, this sure seems to be a major feature". When the only intent in reading a post is to deconstruct it, context has a way of getting overlooked.

I agree, there's no irony there.

In the first case, you're saying that something shouldn't be a major feature.

In the second case, you're questioning someone's authority to deem something a major feature or not.

That's called hypocrisy, not irony.

 

[Felon]

I agree, there's no irony there.

In the first case, you're saying that something shouldn't be a major feature.

In the second case, you're questioning someone's authority to deem something a major feature or not.

That's called hypocrisy, not irony.

Not really. It's more like "taking two separate remarks out of context"--. a common approach when looking to accuse a person of hypocrasy. Allow me to clarify, in the hopes that there's someone out there who's not just looking for opportunities to be ascerbic.

When I say it looks like the previews are being promoted as a big deal, it's because of the times that I go to the WotC website and what I see plastered on the D&D page is "Exclusive preview of the ____! Subscribe now!" Assessing that they've given top billing to the previews isn't an arbitrary dictation, it's just going with the empirical evidence.