D&D General D&D is now Steampunk (poll)

[Burnside]

1E had monks because karate and ninja stuff was a big craze in the U.S. in the 1970s. It had spaceships and laser guns because some people thought it was fun. It has orcs and halflings and rangers because of Tolkien and dinosaurs because of Jules Verne and Arthur Conan Doyle and vampires because of Dracula and mind flayers because of Lovecraft and Greek gods and monsters because of Bullfinch’s Mythology. The idea that the game originally cared much about genres or elements being “right” for a particular real-world earth time period is silly. If anything, it started out much zanier than it now is, got more rigid, and is now opening up again but is still arguably less eclectic and unapologetically weird than 1E was.

 

[Emerikol]

I don't understand why people make an issue of this one. Why is this assumed to be an in-game term? It's a rules term. People aren't saying "Character Class", "Background", "Feat", or "Ability Scores" in-game. Why are we assuming that everyone in the fiction is suddenly saying "Species"?

This is probably where we differ. All of those concepts are known in world for all of my campaigns that had them. They might not use the term "class" but they do know they are a wizard and they are aware of spell progression and when they get a feat. That is character knowledge. And I suspect for my remaining life we will completely ignore ancestry/species and so forth and just say race. I actually think race is more appropriate in D&D than it is in the real world. We are all part of the human race and there is only one human race. Ethnicity would be a better word to use here.

 

[Emerikol]

Nah, LotR was largely unknown in the US until it was embraced by hippie culture in the early 70s and became suddenly massively popular. It went from there into D&D, not from D&D into the US.

It may be that all of this was synergistic. I don't know many former hippies that were reading LOTR's in the 70's. I do know that since D&D, Tolkien has never fall far out of the spotlight. The much later movies though didn't hurt to keep sustaining interest.

 

[Burnside]

They might not use the term "class"

This is literally my entire point. Characters in your game don’t ask each other what character class they are or talk about their Wisdom score. Why then is the rule term “Species” more of a problem?

 

[Autumnal]

Obligatory pedantry: “genus” and “species” are used in Roman-era Latin translations of Aristotle, which made them standard terms through all the following eras. Our current usage of them begins in the early modern era, in the late 1600s, but the words were there, referring to a kind of animals and to a specific form within that kind, everywhere scholars regarded Aristotle as hot stuff.

 

[Burnside]

It may be that all of this was synergistic. I don't know many former hippies that were reading LOTR's in the 70's. I do know that since D&D, Tolkien has never fall far out of the spotlight. The much later movies though didn't hurt to keep sustaining interest.

Tolkien was HUGE with hippies.

Led Zeppelin’s “Ramble On” is from 1969, with lyrics about Lord of the Rings in it, and the college kids all knew what he was singing about.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

It may be that all of this was synergistic. I don't know many former hippies that were reading LOTR's in the 70's. I do know that since D&D, Tolkien has never fall far out of the spotlight. The much later movies though didn't hurt to keep sustaining interest.

Tolkien was like 100 times more popular than D&D in the US in the 70s. It just wasn't comparable. LotR was a cultural phenomena, D&D was an obscure spin off from wargaming.

 

[Emerikol]

This is literally my entire point. Characters in your game don’t ask each other what character class they are or talk about their Wisdom score. Why then is the rule term “Species” more of a problem?

And I disagree if by ask you mean transfer the information and not use the specific word. My groups want to know if someone is a fighter, rogue, wizard, cleric, etc... They will try to discern that information in game. They might say "What are they?" when asking about race. They may not say race all the time. They will ask "Is he an elf or dwarf etc...?"

 

[James Gasik]

Tolkien was HUGE with hippies.

Led Zeppelin’s “Ramble On” is from 1969, with lyrics about Lord of the Rings in it, and the college kids all knew what he was singing about.

Or this, from "The Battle Of Evermore":

The pain of war cannot exceed
The woe of aftermath
The drums will shake the castle wall
The ringwraiths ride in black
Ride on

 

[Steampunkette]

It should be by pointed out that waistcoats and pockets are in the book, not just the movies. Bilbo’s outfit is directly based on Tolkien’s own drawing.

But even more telling is Tolkien’s illustration of the hall of Bag End, which has an aneroid barometer (invented 1843) on the wall.

Not only do I agree it should be pointed out, I pointed it out in the post you quoted.

So I'm glad we agree!