Design & Development: Warlord Article UP!

[Fallen Seraph]

Sorry for that, I guess since in how I am going to play/how I see it, in my eyes/feel of the game it already "is" and things already "are" like that, if you get what I mean.

As for second part, I think there could perhaps (especially given the outcry on the forums) perhaps a section in the combat chapter or in each class-power chapter describing how to use the powers descriptively/placed within the world.

 

[KarinsDad]

As for second part, I think there could perhaps (especially given the outcry on the forums) perhaps a section in the combat chapter or in each class-power chapter describing how to use the powers descriptively/placed within the world.

Agreed.

However, I do think that some of the outcry is knee jerk reaction to change, and some of the fanboy is knee jerk reaction to cool new stuff. Once we have all of the rules, the outcry and fanboy stuff should at least be derived (rightfully so or not) on more factual and complete elements of the game system.

 

[Kishin]

Sorry for that, I guess since in how I am going to play/how I see it, in my eyes/feel of the game it already "is" and things already "are" like that, if you get what I mean.

As for second part, I think there could perhaps (especially given the outcry on the forums) perhaps a section in the combat chapter or in each class-power chapter describing how to use the powers descriptively/placed within the world.

I'm trying to think of a way to not sound overly harsh in saying this, but isn't that the DM's job?
It strikes me as overdoing it and verging into handholding on WoTC's part. I'm sure most DMs can sit and think about it, and come up with a way to describe each power's function, or simply fire it off as part of an evolving battle narrative.

 

[Fallen Seraph]

Actually just got me thinking, it be interesting if the DMG had a section devoted to. Narrative and Description.

Since not every DM is a scholar of english some would have trouble with narrative and descriptive format so having a section devoted to how one can quickly use descriptive text in-game could be quite helpful.

But all I can write for now, since Rome is about to begin! (damn not having HBO and having to wait for it to come onto History).

Edit: I didn't notice your post (was typing this) but I think what I wrote here could relate to that as well.

 

[small pumpkin man]

That doesn't really explain what happens because the daily power is no automatic hit.
If they really try to do it all the time and only succeed once a day then they would constantly get the "miss" result of the power except once.
No, they only try it once per day and otherwise use different combat powers.

No, the idea they it several times per day and get different outcomes is perfectly acceptable. It's like a crit, except the player decides when to do/try it instead of the the dice deciding when it happens.

The difference between giving Fighters cool crit abilities and 4e style encounter/daily abilities is exactly the same as the difference between Stormbringer style low hp, low chance of hitting and D&D's high hp, high chance of hitting (which implies that most hits up untill the last aren't really hits).

If you're not okay with that, if that breaks your WSoD, that's fine, but don't tell people it can't work that way, that they're invloved in badwrongfun, when one of the most basic tropes of D&D works exactly the same way.

 

[Marshall]

My first Warlord character is going to be named Admiral Thrawn.

Oohh....Thats perfect. Thrawn is a classic epic level Warlord.

 

[Spatula]

I have to admit that I find these types of power rationals (or explanations) somewhat amusing.

It's nearly impossible to rationalize game mechanic derived from other game mechanics. A daily is a game mechanic solely introduced as a big gun ability balanced by a limited frequency, nothing more. It's pure game mechanics. Trying to make sense of it (for the entire gaming population) is difficult or impossible because it is not a model of the fantasy world. It is a model of the game mechanics.

<snip>

Of course, everything you said here applies equally well to all editions of D&D. If it's impossible to rationalize daily allotments of divine, arcane, and "human" power, then when has D&D ever made sense?

 

[Storm-Bringer]

That can be summed up in a variety of ways, different opponents act differently meaning that it becomes much more difficult to strike through, they wear armour there, they try but the blade is shoved aside causing only a normal wound, etc.

They are always trying to pull it off, but the chances of them pulling it off is so rare it only occurs once-a-day (if it occurs, seeing how the characters/players won't always use the same daily powers each day or any at all).

Your also right that the player has some control over the opponent in that the player decides when this advantage (daily-power) comes into play. But that is sorta the idea of this kind of narrative-gameplay in which the players can also influence the world around them/the events going on in them slightly (though of course from the character perspective it is simply them gaining a advantage).

You are right that the probability of having that advantage goes from 100% to 0% (it is isn't reliable) from the players perspective. But the character wouldn't view it as the advantage entirely disappearing, but simply that completing that advantage or having the full advantage simply doesn't materialize.

And from what I am reading, that is where most people have the disconnect.

It's as though the first group of Orcs that day is able to transmit some kind of quantum entangled message to any other Orcs you run into the rest of the day not to drop their guard after a parry (for example), but the following day, everyone forgets that, until your Warlord uses their daily Super Saiyan Teamwork 9000 talent again. After which, of course, everyone remembers to keep their guard up after a parry, again.

The ability should be throttled back quite a bit and made per encounter. Daily martial powers should be spectacular and cost hit points or experience points to activate or something similar. These are supposed to be the 'massive come back attacks' everyone points to in the movies after the good guy has been beaten down by the minions, and almost killed by the Level Boss.

 

[Storm-Bringer]

Of course, everything you said here applies equally well to all editions of D&D. If it's impossible to rationalize daily allotments of divine, arcane, and "human" power, then when has D&D ever made sense?

Except that allotments of divine and arcane power have always been rationalized. The explanations have not always held up to scrutiny, but they were there. No previous edition has ever tried to explain how the fighter can only make 'five attacks per two rounds' once a day, because that would have been silly. Fighter abilities have always been 'at will', which is why they were relatively weaker than divine or arcane powers. Sure, the MU may have fireball memorized three times, but the fighter can swing a sword all day long. Because that matches with people's perceptions. Granted, four or five combats a day would have even the most well-trained fighter exhausted, but there is already a mechanic for that without limiting whatever tricks they can pull off.

What doesn't match perceptions is teamwork that only works on a diurnal cycle. What doesn't match perceptions is a bleeding ability that not only works against hit points that don't represent physical damage, but also only works once a day. Especially after shutting down the console having played X-Men Legends or Ulitmate Alliance, where Wolverine or several other characters get bleed damage on every attack. What doesn't match perceptions are mundane (non-magical) abilities that have a magic-like limit on their uses.

For example, the martial characters we have seen show 'melee attack' as an at-will. Can I swap that with a per-encounter? Does everyone get 'melee attack' on the at-will list, but martial characters get it free? Does the Wizard not get a 'melee attack' if they don't take it as one of their at-will powers? Or is it a per-encounter for the Wizard?

I believe Martial Powers is going to remain a large stumbling block for some time to come.

 

[Zimri]

Except that allotments of divine and arcane power have always been rationalized. The explanations have not always held up to scrutiny, but they were there. No previous edition has ever tried to explain how the fighter can only make 'five attacks per two rounds' once a day, because that would have been silly. Fighter abilities have always been 'at will', which is why they were relatively weaker than divine or arcane powers. Sure, the MU may have fireball memorized three times, but the fighter can swing a sword all day long. Because that matches with people's perceptions. Granted, four or five combats a day would have even the most well-trained fighter exhausted, but there is already a mechanic for that without limiting whatever tricks they can pull off.

What doesn't match perceptions is teamwork that only works on a diurnal cycle. What doesn't match perceptions is a bleeding ability that not only works against hit points that don't represent physical damage, but also only works once a day. Especially after shutting down the console having played X-Men Legends or Ulitmate Alliance, where Wolverine or several other characters get bleed damage on every attack. What doesn't match perceptions are mundane (non-magical) abilities that have a magic-like limit on their uses.

For example, the martial characters we have seen show 'melee attack' as an at-will. Can I swap that with a per-encounter? Does everyone get 'melee attack' on the at-will list, but martial characters get it free? Does the Wizard not get a 'melee attack' if they don't take it as one of their at-will powers? Or is it a per-encounter for the Wizard?

I believe Martial Powers is going to remain a large stumbling block for some time to come.

Would it perhaps calm some of the teapotted tempest if there was a "deity" of martial ability that granted these boons .. I'm sure someone could stat him up if it would help believability.