Do You Give XPs Twice for a Creature That's Been Raised?

[Aluvial]

My PCs have killed some minions of a group of high level clerics.

When they died, the PCs withdrew and the NPC clerics used Raise Dead to bring them back. I awarded XPs once for these guys, should I award it again?

Just to let you know, there are two of them, both CR 9... The cleric is higher of-course and was able to take the spell twice.

What should I do?

Aluvial

 

[kreynolds]

When they died, the PCs withdrew and the NPC clerics used {i]Raise Dead[/i] to bring them back. I awarded XPs once for these guys, should I award it again?

If the PCs defeat them again? IMO, definately Yes.

 

[Skinwalker]

The bottom line is, the villains have a couple CR 9 minions the PCs have to face. It doesn't matter whether these are CR 9 minions that have been defeated in a previous encounter or two wholly different CR 9 minions. The party faces danger in the form of these minions and must use resources to overcome them. They deserve XP for this.

If that doesn't convince you, you will want to consider the ramifications of establishing a policy of 'you only get XP for a creature once no matter how many times you face/defeat it.' Your PCs will likely react by using every means at their disposal to make sure there is no way possible that even the bit player villains could ever be brought back, even via True Ressurection. Off the top of my head, I think I'd cremate them and store the ashes in Bag of Holding or a Portable Hole. When that got full, I'd toss it in another Bag of Holding/Portable hole to dispose of the ashes. A Sphere of Annihilation would be another good method. There are countless other ways to permanently dispose of bodies (I think there was even a thread on this a while back), but my point is by making that ruling you would completely discourage any form of mercy on the part of the PCs and probably dramatically escalate the overall deadliness of the campaign.

 

[Darkness]

What should I do?

Subtract a level from the raised NPCs, which also lowers their CR by 1. (Side effect of raise dead. Skip this if they have time and opportunity to gain enough xp to advance in level again, for some reason.)

Then, they'll probably be re-equipped. Depending on the resources of the cleric & his allies, they might get as much gear as they did last time, or merely a rusty dagger and a leather armor. (Or maybe they'll now get the really big guns, to make sure they'll defeat the PCs this time. It all depends...) If their new equipment is far less (or far more) than the average for their level, this will modify EL, at least.

And yeah - if the PCs win again, they'll get xp again. But probably less, due to a lower CR (and possibly a yet lower EL, due to poor equipment), unless the NPCs can manage to totally replenish their levels and gear.

 

[drnuncheon]

Definitely. You'd award XP again if the clerics went out and got new 9th level minions, wouldn't you?

J

 

[Aluvial]

Thanks again for the responses...

I suppose I was thinking that it was somewhat similar to Summoned Creatures... You don't get XPs for them, that is part of the experience you get for the caster when you defeat him.

This struck me the same way, if a high level caster, (higher CR) uses some of his abilities to Raise Dead, then that all goes under his CR.

If I do give the PCs for the two already once defeated foes, it will be at a lower CR because they did lose a level.

Anyway, that's what I was thinking.

As for the campaigns deadliness raising... it has already happened. As soon as I brought them back from the dead, one player says, "I will now always take the time to chop the head from each of my fallen foes..."

But believe me, if that starts to happen, it starts to happen both ways... no more of the bad guys letting unconscious foes off the hook because they are defeated.... this is my usual policy, and I always reasoned that if a PC goes to negatives, he is no longer a threat, the creature who defeated him would move to a 'live' target and play would move on.

Of course many more times than not, the PC would get a Cure spell mid-battle and would again be in the fray!

If they start chopping heads, so will I!

It seems that this type of escalation is unavoidable when the PCs (and their opponents) start being able to bring back the dead!

Aluvial

 

[Pax]

My PCs have killed some minions of a group of high level clerics.

When they died, the PCs withdrew and the NPC clerics used {i]Raise Dead[/i] to bring them back. I awarded XPs once for these guys, should I award it again?

The thing to remeber here is, you don't have to KILL someone to earn experience, you simply have to DEFEAT the CHALLENGE they present.

If you encounter the same wily wizard, time and again, and he teleports away just before he can be killed (via Elminster's Evasion perhaps) -- you get full XP for him each and every time.

XP awards are for passing a challenge; as teh book explains, if the PCs have to get past a Minotaur guard, there are SEVERAL ways to do so, all of which earn full marks WRT experience awards (specifically, as a non-exhaustive list: sneak past; attack and kill it; talk to it and perhaps bribe it; use deceptive magics to lure it away form it's post long enough to get by).

 

[Staffan]

As an aside, if someone gets brought back to life and full power in the middle of a fight I'd probably consider *that* as part of the CR of whomever did it - after all, they had to expend time/spells/whatever to do it. If it's done off-screen, it's a new encounter and warrants new CR/XP.

 

[The Sigil]

I agree with Staffan.

Figure the experience per ENCOUNTER - if you defeat them and they get raised, you defeat them, they get raised, etc. all in the same encounter, you only get the XP once.

If you defeat them, they get raised and later encounter you again, you get XP again.

Hope that made sense - XP is awarded once per foe per encounter.

--The Sigil

 

[niteshade6]

I might make one exception to this....

If the PCs fight the minions, then they get raised and have to fight them again the same day, and then in that same day they also have to fight the clerics who now have substantialy less spells from raising and healing their minions, then they should only get the minion xp once. This is because the raising of them is part of the CR of the clerics who they are also getting xps for defeating.

But if it's just fight the minions, fight the minions again, and go home, then yeah they should definetely get the xp twice.