does a nice, shy, meek guy have a chance in hell?

[Aaron L]

Heh, actually, I sit around my house all day, sometimes just lat in bed. Then I get up and go for a walk, usually 5 to 10 miles a day. The walks arent always much fun. Within the last 2 months Ive had:

A car full of girls drive past me, yell "get a life" and throw a condom out the window at me.

someone yell "hey ugly" at me yes it was at me, thee was no one else around and they lauhed when i sped up and ran past)

someone threw a full plasic cup of soda pop at me from moving van. i got soaked, and it was pretty cold out


other than walking i do nothing. ive lost 30 pounds since this time last year from just walking, 12 in the last 2 months. i go give blood every couple weeks(well, whenever its time again), but that isnt really much. every so often i have a friend who will call me to go out, but ive been hearing from her less and less.


id move away like my brother did (he moved to pittsburgh, dont hear from him much anymore. hes the confident charismatic one and always got me through everything, and all my friends were friends of his) but i quite frankly couldnt survive without my mother. i cant remember doctors appointments, when to take my medicine, and i certainly cant make my own appointments. im quite a mess. I know i lack confidence, i just have no idea how to gain any, especially when i dont have any reason to have any, and quite a lot of reason not to have any.

 

[fusangite]

Heh, actually, I sit around my house all day, sometimes just lat in bed. Then I get up and go for a walk, usually 5 to 10 miles a day. The walks arent always much fun. Within the last 2 months Ive had:

A car full of girls drive past me, yell "get a life" and throw a condom out the window at me.

someone yell "hey ugly" at me yes it was at me, thee was no one else around and they lauhed when i sped up and ran past)

someone threw a full plasic cup of soda pop at me from moving van. i got soaked, and it was pretty cold out

id move away like my brother did (he moved to pittsburgh) but i quite frankly couldnt survive without my mother. i cant remember doctors appointments, when to take my medicine, and i certainly cant make my own appointments. im quite a mess.

My uncle Barton had a measurable IQ of 47 and never learned to read. He took about 15 pills a day and lived by himself. If you are capable of participating in this online debate, you are certainly capable of developing a routine that will allow you to take your medication without maternal assistance. I'm sure a social worker could work with you to develop customized routines for your meds. Either that or you could invest you cigarette money in an electronic organizer/souped-up phone one month.

As for making your own appointments, how, exactly, is that impossible?

You need to get away from this horrible town where people throw things at you and scream epithets. Move to Pittsburgh for goodness sake!

 

[Warrior Poet]

It sure would be great if people who suggested that had practical suggestions for doing so, wouldn't it? Any hints for actually doing that?

And I said:

do something nice for someone else (and NOT with any kind of ulterior motive like "maybe that person will like me if I do this!"). Why? 1) It takes you outside yourself and forces you to focus on something other than how miserable you may feel, and 2) it helps you build your confidence because you can see results and recognize progress (like with an exercise program, fund-raising drive, or mowing the lawn, for example). Can't do any heavy lifting with your back, but could you volunteer to read to those in the hospital, or do a program like Recording for the Blind and Dyslexic (http://www.rfbd.org), or walk a neighbor's dog, or answer the telephone at a help center?

I also said:

Have you thought about moving?

At one point, with regard to the potential drinking issue, as well as self confidence issues, I suggested:

seek professional, medical help in the form of counseling

But enough sounding my own horn. There are far wiser people than I who have made helpful suggestions as well, including:

Rel, who said:

Actually my suggestion would be to find some kind of volunteer work that isn't too hard on the back. I think that helping other people is a lot more of a confidence builder and (by definition) social activity than doing anything for yourself. Might as well put some of Aaron's greatest asset (niceness) to work making other people's day and life a little better. That's really the environment in which that attribute shines brightest and seems least out of place and (potentially for women that he'd encounter) off-putting and clingy.

And Infiniti2000 said:

Definitely not. Having worked as a dietary aid in a nursing home while in high school, I can guarantee you that this is not a good idea. You have one chance in maybe a hundred thousand of finding a suitable woman there, and then the atmosphere of the place will totally remove any romantic attitudes. Go to a hospital instead.

While BardStephenFox recently noted:

Heck, help children learn to read.

And Starman said:

I just started acting like I was totally confident about everything and anything. Inside I wasn't, but I wasn't showing anyone that. Eventually I started becoming more confident on the inside. I even had one person tell me that I'm intimidating because I'm so confident. It was more than faking it, of course, but it helped me out. Maybe it will work for you, too.

Future Sword-and-Planet author Joshua Dyal mentioned:

If you don't have one already, get a hobby that you can indulge in whenever, that's not dependent on anyone else. Mini painting, for instance, or working out, or ...I dunno, something. Something that you feel a real sense of accomplishment from working on.

And that's just to name a few. If those aren't concrete suggestions to help get started, I don't know what are. There isn't necessarily some magic formula we can all just post that solves the issue every time, but I think most folks on this thread have legitimately tried to help, and have often offered actual suggestions of some ways to begin.

Warrior Poet

 

[WhimsyTheFae]

Confidence 101 (I'll leave the 200/300/400 classes for others)

So, you want to build confidence. Normally confidence is felt when you do something that you're good at. Here is a step-by-step process to build some confidence (maybe not a lot, but it's a start).

Step 1. Get a piece of paper.

Step 2. Get a pencil (or pen).

Step 3. Write down at least 5 things that you are good at (making people laugh, math, eating, whatever).

Step 4. Put a check mark by each one (you're already good at them, mission accomplished - in the correct situations, these will be your strengths - this is you starting point...your initial confidence).

***at this point, you can feel free to stop, try and channel your activities to the things that you've listed and move forward with the confidence that you already have)***

Step 5. Start a new column of things that you want to be good at.

Step 6. Identify activities that will help you become good at those things (if you put dancing, take a class; if you put better physical appearance, start exercising - perhaps you can help your back/if not, try and work around it, that's what I have to do when my back fails me - ; if you want to be a better conversationalist, join some sort of public speaking group like an Optimists Club or something).

Step 7. Face these new activities as a challenge and overcome them (will it be daunting, probably; will you be afraid, I am at times; will it add some initial stress, yes - live with it, for to build confidence you have to move outside your comfort zone).

Step 8. Recognize your growing confidence as you are able to do things you weren't able to before or do things better than you were able to before.

Step 9. Don't become arrogant .

Step 10. If you aren't interested in it, don't do it (you don't need to be good at everything in order to be confident, there are only so many hours in the day).

I suffer from social anxiety (moderate to debilitating) and have had times where I've broken down to a shaken puddle of human flesh. I have been paralyzed by my fear and have often found it easier to run the other way, but let me say that when I stiffen my upper lip, tell my brain to F-OFF (sorry Eric's Grandma) and jump into the uncomfortable situation I often find that it isn't even close to as bad as I thought that it would be (and usually I thank myself, later)...

If you are uncomfortable in public situations, get in them. If you are uncomfortable asking women on a date, ask them (it's one thing to flirt with a women, it's another thing totally to just come right out and say, "would you like to go out on a date this weekend?" - after you talk for a bit, of course). If you have a social flaw that may turn women off, be upfront with it (I don't know much about Tourette's, but if you aren't already doing so, disclose the information in a way that says, "yes, I have Tourette's, but it isn't an issue").

Part of the difficulty in giving advice on being more confident, is that you sort of have to just do it. Puff your chest out (not in a weird way), walk with a swagger (not too much) and know inside that you are cool with you (if lady #1 isn't, it's her loss, so go on and talk to lady #2). Don't act, it's too easy to see through (in other words, don't fake confidence - stick with what your good at and become good at more things), unless you are a very good actor (in which case, I would say that you have some confidence that you aren't admitting to).

Take all of this as what it is - a work in progress. I have been successful when I have followed this advice and have failed miserably when I have deviated. I have tried to act cool, but failed because it was clear to everyone that I wasn't what I was trying to be (in my case, I can do funny, flirtatious and spontaneous; I don't do tough, worldly or enigmatic and I am only moderately successful at intellectual, introspective and philosophical). Do what your good at and get better at what you want to do (that is what I am working on - for example, I don't want to be tough, so I'll skip that one - I would like to be more intellectual, so I try to educate myself). This year has been a year of challenges, successes and failures - I came out of my shell at Gen Con and met a lot of great people and had fun (success), I joined the Jaycees in order to volunteer my time and become more social (work in progress), I enrolled in school to get a bachelor's in management (failure at the moment).

Hopefully some of this helps, but it is really just a more detailed way of saying to just do it and don't worry about what other people think. If you succeed, pat yourself on the back. If you fail, learn from it. Don't give up. Don't surrender. You are your own worst enemy, your own best friend and your own greatest coach.

Positive thinking is your biggest weapon, no matter how lame or flower child that sounds. This will take time.

 

[Warrior Poet]

ive lost 30 pounds since this time last year from just walking, 12 in the last 2 months.

Aaron, congratulations. You've accomplished something, a worthy, worthwhile thing, and you made progress, so now, try to look back on that and recognize it as an achievement, not just a circumstance. You did it! No one else did. You lost the 30. Know how many people would like to lose 30 lbs.? But you did it. OK, one accomplishment in the bank. Another accomplishment might be maintaining your weight and working on physical therapy to improve your back. It will take time, effort, and you can measure your progress (including setbacks, which happen to everybody. Everybody).

i go give blood every couple weeks(well, whenever its time again), but that isnt really much.

On the contrary, that IS much. Do you know how often blood banks are short of the monthly amounts they'd like to have? So, there's something else you've done that is significant, and measurable, and also highly altruistic and generous. You've already established that you're a nice guy, and now you can take Confidence in the fact that you contribute something back to people who need it.

every so often i have a friend who will call me to go out, but ive been hearing from her less and less.

OK, so why don't you give her a call. See? She's been calling you, but if you don't call her, she's going to feel like she makes all the effort, why doesn't he call? So call, and go out. Get out there.

all my friends were friends of his

OK, fair enough, so now maybe it's time to meet some people on your own and make them your own friends. Not your brother's friends (and there's nothing wrong with them), but your own, which means putting yourself into social situations, finding common interests with people, and discussing those things, then setting future plans to meet with those people and continue the discussions, or try new things, and visit places of interest to spark further connection.

but i quite frankly couldnt survive without my mother. i cant remember doctors appointments, when to take my medicine, and i certainly cant make my own appointments. im quite a mess.

OK, this might be another reason to seek professional help from a doctor or counselor who might be able to advise you on ways to develop more independence, and independence breeds . . . Confidence!

I know i lack confidence, i just have no idea how to gain any, especially when i dont have any reason to have any, and quite a lot of reason not to have any.

But you do have reason, and that's what a lot of us have been trying to tell you. You need to see your accomplishments as accomplishments, not just circumstance. Hell, Aaron, I don't give blood, and that's really lame. How hard is it to do? But you do it, regularly, and that's something you can have confidence in, feel good about yourself about (my god, what an awful prepositional train wreck that sentence was).

You have to realize you do have reasons. We can't realize it for you. You have to realize that you do have reasons.

Warrior Poet

 

[Maerdwyn]

im quite a mess. I know i lack confidence, i just have no idea how to gain any, especially when i dont have any reason to have any, and quite a lot of reason not to have any.

(I agree with those who have suggested counseling - that should come first in my opinion. This is for after you've set that up...)

In my experience, self confidence/good self esteem, etc. are not something you achieve, but rather, by-products of achievement in something you care about. As you suggested, if there's no reason for you to be proud of yourself, you won't be, or you'll just be unjustifiably proud of yourself, which isn't much better (That descibes a bunch of people I know, and they're insufferable).

If what you are doing now, as far as your work and personal life go, doesn't fill with pride or at least respect for yourself, then find something that does. To start, I would suggest starting to do something that is not centered on yourself - do some good for someone else or a group of people, without looking for any tangible benefit to yourself. Giving blood is great - how about spending a day at a blood bank helping out? Volunteer in a school, a hospital, a church, a political or environmental cause, etc. It can be something big, or if you are apprehensive about it at first, something small - even just a single day's work at something you will feel good about having done afterwards, and especially, during.

No one is going to be calling you ugly or trying to avoid you, etc. if you are working towards a similar goal with them, and you'll get your mind off yourself and self pity while at the same time doing something decent or good for the society around you.

 

[Warrior Poet]

Within the last 2 months Ive had:

'em.

Let the recounting of those incidents be the last time you think about them. Those people are gone and done. You have a life to get to, and you're too busy to dwell on the those idiots dished out. You're too busy, because you have important things to do, starting right now.

In other news, I should've just waited for FickleGM to post. Great post. Great post.

Warrior Poet

 

[Dark Jezter]

As I mentioned previously, while some people can choose to ignore all the empirical evidence and believe certain things simply because they want to believe them, I don't think Aaron is one of them. Just because he knows his beliefs about how things will go are a negative influence doesn't mean he can choose not to hold them. What amazes me is that even when I write posts predicting the "self confidence" discourse that will appear on these threads, people still engage in it anyway

Perhaps we still engage in it because we don't agree with you and have seen proof otherwise. I've seen more than one guy in situations similar to Aaron's who managed to turn their lives around after making changes to their life starting with their attitude.

Aaron, himself, states that he knows that his lack of self-confidence is his single biggest problem in dealing with women; he wants to gain it. When somebody says, "I really need to learn how to build my self confidence, because without it I know I'm doomed to fail," you're not telling them anything when you respond, "You really need to build your self confidence, because without it you're doomed to fail," especially when you present this as though it's news to the person.Yes. It sure would be great if people who suggested that had practical suggestions for doing so, wouldn't it?Any hints for actually doing that?

People have been giving suggestions this whole thread, with some of them quite good. In the end, though, only Aaron can pull Aaron out of the trap of self-pity and start building confidence in himself.

I find discussions like this weirdly annoying. If somebody said, "I need to get $10,000 or I won't be able to make a down payment on a house that's just come up for sale," and people responded, "You know what you need to do? Get $10,000. That's what you need to do. If you don't get $10,000, you won't be able to make that down payment," people would laugh at them.

Apples and oranges. Self-image is not home financing.

 

[sarabethv]

I will admit that I didn't read every single reply, so forgive me if I repeat something.

Please pay attention to the advice about depression and self worth (I did read some of them and the advice is valid) but my advice is a little different.

Look around you. Seriously, I have a few friends who are pretty much in the same boat, they are guys in their late 20s saying that they can't get a date. I can tell you that the girls they look at are in general pretty and selfish and concerned only with themselves. These women are not gonna look at you unless you have something they want.

So, let me ask you; "what type of female do you go for?" Who do you ask out, or want to ask out? Now look around. There is probably some geeky girl, maybe a little overweight, maybe a little too skinny, maybe she wears glasses or maybe she is really pretty but hides behind a book. I'm sure there is one around you, perhaps a friend and you have ignored this female cause she isn't what you picture as "dating material."

Try and ask these girls out - you may wind up a winner with someone you care about and who really cares about you.

 

[Audhild&Krin]

I have nothing to add about gaining confidence, the others posters have great suggestions. However, I do want to share a revelation I had a number of years ago.

You mentioned some jerks that attacked you verbally and physically while out walking. They are gaining a false sense of confidence by degrading you. When a person feels the need to degrade, demean and be a jerk to another they are trying to justify their own existence. If they were truly happy with themselves they would have no need to hurt another. I have found that the amount of pain they try to inflict on another is equal to the pain they themselves feel. Just keep that in mind the next time someone is abusive.

Congratulations on the weight loss!