Fighters vs mages at high level.

[AraSlayer]

Hi there,

Me and a friend was wondering something... what could do a fighter to beat up a mage at high lvl, let's say lvl 30. We said that I would build for fun a lvl 30 fighter (or fighter like, could have some prestiges like weapon master or tempest, or even others) and he makes a lvl 30 mage (or mage like classes/prestiges) and see what one can do vs the other. I know D&D isn't made for player vs player, but still, we would like to see it.

Now I need help building that char. I was thinking of a dual weild with monkey grip (since he is epic and could take epic feats) with "I don't know what weapons". I would like to build up the mightiest fighter with a lot of damage, since it's not for roleplay but for test. Can you help me for prestiges/feats/weapons for let's say a lvl 30 fighter type ? Thanks for your help.

(Those who fear munchkining don't read any further)

P.S. Sorry if my english is bad, i'm french

 

[silentspace]

After level 1, take the next 29 levels in druid

 

[AraSlayer]

Thanks to be serious.

 

[Jdvn1]

You could go Monk or Occult Slayer or take those Mage Slayer feats... but the Wizard tends to have the advantage.

 

[silentspace]

Thanks to be serious.

Well, it was sort of serious. What can the fighter do? A twinked out fighter can do one or two things well, like hit stuff hard and take a lot of damage. What can a level 30 wizard do? Pretty much everything. Really. So someone who can do one or two things well vs someone who can do everything... The person who can do everything wins.

Wizards have a sort of favored position in D&D. The game designers love wizards. 3.5 was largely about trying to weaken wizards and strengthen fighters, because wizards were just so much more powerful than fighters. They succeeded a little. But a level 30 wizard will still trounce a level 30 fighter.

 

[Crothian]

A wizard and a Fighter don't compaire well. If the Wizard has time to prepare, the wizard is a great class. But Fighters can react better to unusualy situations they are not ready for.

Wizards also have more limited resources as their strength is spells and they do run out. A Fighter though can potential attack things for a lot longer.

Having characters fight each other is not the way to figure out if they are even in strength.

 

[Victim]

If you want to make a fighter good at killing wizards, you need to work mostly on your item selection. The fighter that does the most damage isn't all that great against a wizard - if you get a full attack melee, the wizard will probably lose anyway. It's not a matter of how big your best attack is, it's how you find a way to deliver it. Instead, make sure you can fly, see invisible (True Seeing is better), be mind blanked, teleport, etc. You need to be able to close against flying, invisible wizard who opens the fight with a Force Cage.

 

[pbd]

Try some archer builds. At that level you should be able to get at least 6 shots a round with an attack of +42/+42/+42/+37/+32/+27 (BAB +30, dex +4 [conservative, could be +8 - 10], +4 bow, greater weapon focus, point blank shot, improved rapid shot, haste). Damager per hit can also be very good. If the wiard start switht he force cage, you can shoot through the bars...

Just a thought.

pbd

 

[Celebrim]

A 30th level archer could conceivably a big problem for a wizard. Remember, there are epic feats that allow archers to fire at anything in line of sight, regardless of distance.

Basically, in order for a fighter to compete with a wizard at high levels, the fighter has to be allowed to break the rules of reality and become a supernatural being himself. He has to be able to throw that greatsword like a lighting bolt, parry spells, shatter mountains with his blows, and so forth. Assuming that you accept that, a high level wizard and a high level fighter are on equal footing. If you on the other hand decide that a high level fighter still has to conform to the bounds of realism, while the high level wizard is summoning meteors out of the sky while flying through the air, then naturally you are going to be disappointed at the balance between wizards and fighters.

If the wizard starts with the force cage, you can shoot through the bars...

Presumably, high level fighters can break force cages with their bare hands, and high level rogues could slip through the gaps no matter how small you made them.

 

[Jack Simth]

At epic level 30, on the first round, you opposing wizard can Gate in an Old Force Dragon (55 hd, 1,292 hp, 45d12 breath weapon (dc 54) and have no trouble controlling it despite dropping a level due to expending the 1000 exp. If he goes that route, there's a pretty good chance he can two-turn you (one to summon dragon, one to dragon-blast you), if you can't get him in that timeframe. If he goes the route of best possible save DC, he has a lot of "save or die" spells available; if he has epic slots (10+ spell level, or spends lots of feats to get Automatic Quicken Spell up there), he can even Quicken them, and pump them out at 2 a round. If he gets Epic Spells, you're dead, pretty much period. If he loves touch attacks, targetted Meteor Swarms will reduce you rather quickly. And that's just SRD.

Take improved initiative, high dex, and anything you can find to boost your chances of getting the first strike; you need to get him FAST before he can do anything. I'd actually suggest a rogue based build - a vanilla rouge at that level will get +15d6 damage from the sneak attack if you catch him flat-footed, and as he stays flat-footed until his turn, well, you get lots of attacks using Full Attack at that level (if you start within range, or can find a way to close the gap without using a move or standard action). Add in Epic weapon enchantments, Save or Die enchantments, perhaps something to paralize him ... and you might have a chance.