Fighters vs mages at high level.

[Jack Simth]

Another option would be to forego magic items (almost) entierly and get a magic item of Antimagic Field, continuous - Let's see... Spell Effect, Continuous: Spell level x caster level x 2,000 gp; Antimagic Field - Sor/Wiz 6, minimum caster level 11; 6*11*2000=132,000 gp - should be in your price range (as it is just the one combat, you could also get a scroll and Use Magic Device to activate it - but the item is cooler, and you will have lots of cash to burn with only one magic item that functions), and around 99% of his spells will be quite useless (Gate still causes problems (called creatures can penetrate the field), epic spells can as well, if they have a high caster level (and as he can maybe reach Caster Level 35-40 if he plays his cards right, he can usually beat the 1d20+20), battlefield control spells can ruin your day). Maybe put it on a Monk.

 

[Goblyn]

I'd actually suggest a rogue based build - a vanilla rouge at that level will get +15d6 damage from the sneak attack if you catch him flat-footed, and as he stays flat-footed until his turn, well, you get lots of attacks using Full Attack at that level (if you start within range, or can find a way to close the gap without using a move or standard action).

Even better, if just using srd, there exist the psionic feeats, which allow the rogue to have his psionic focus, move faster, and make a full attack at the end of a charge(to take advantage of the flat-footedness). Not to mention prolly taking no damage for anything that lets a save for half.

 

[boredgremlin]

Hi there,

Me and a friend was wondering something... what could do a fighter to beat up a mage at high lvl, let's say lvl 30. We said that I would build for fun a lvl 30 fighter (or fighter like, could have some prestiges like weapon master or tempest, or even others) and he makes a lvl 30 mage (or mage like classes/prestiges) and see what one can do vs the other. I know D&D isn't made for player vs player, but still, we would like to see it.

Now I need help building that char. I was thinking of a dual weild with monkey grip (since he is epic and could take epic feats) with "I don't know what weapons". I would like to build up the mightiest fighter with a lot of damage, since it's not for roleplay but for test. Can you help me for prestiges/feats/weapons for let's say a lvl 30 fighter type ? Thanks for your help.

(Those who fear munchkining don't read any further)

P.S. Sorry if my english is bad, i'm french

You buy magic items with silence on them permanently. Its only a second level spell so the items are dirt cheap. throw them all around the mage so he is helpless. Alternatively take arrows or sling stones with silence on them. Again because the spell is cheap you can get a bunch. Thunderstones are good too. Even at high level the mages fortitude save sucks. And who says you cant pay more to get an even more powerfull stone? Any effect to deafen the mage severely weakens him, any silence damn near nerfs him.
The high level mage will likely have a few silent spells. So buy many cheap silence stones. That way if he moves you can use one of your 5 attacks to throw another one at his new location. He may have silent attack spells. You have a ton of feats. Take iron will and lightning reflexes and buy cloaks of resistance. Improved initiative is good too.
Also an archer fighter will often trounce a mage. The mages range is less important, rapid shot lets you still attack as many times, and the spells can have silence on them. A poison for intelligence is also good, or alternatively STR. The wizards paltry STR score is easily attacked with poison. And reducing it to 0 kills a mage as dead as a fighter.
So in closing, iron will, improved initiative, rapid shot, multi arrow feat from the epic book, uncanny accuracy from the epic book (in case of spells to create a miss chance), improved many shot, epic will and epic reflexes, or if you go melee substitute a missile feat for the spellcasting harries (-15 to concentration checks to cast defensively), and the dire charge. Devastating critical is also lethal, especially to low fortitude characters ( on any critical hit the target must make a fortitude save DC 10 1/2 character level plus STR mod. For an average of 30 or so, assuming +5 STR. ) Combine this with a longsword or other high crit range weapon the improved crit prerequisite means a long sword will crit on a 16+ with a 30 DC fort save required. Thats one dead wizard. Especially with deafen and silence keeping him gimped.

 

[Thanee]

Antimagic Field + Grapple.

Bye
Thanee

 

[silentspace]

All good suggestions. To give the above-posted suggestions a chance at being successful, I suggest getting your DM to make some house rules, such as removing the spells Foresight and Contingency, to start. Also disallow Epic Spellcasting and all epic wizard feats. And make up some new uber-powerful epic fighter feats. Also, have the battle start in a 10'x10' room, with no means of escape.

 

[silentspace]

It's still the same issue - making the fighter really good at one or two things. The reason the wizard wins is that he is good at everything. Hence, he can change the conditions to one where the fighter's strength, whatever that is, is nullified. (Think of Iraq and its powerful army of tanks). Your best bet is to twink out your fighter best you can, hope you win initiative, and hope the wizard doesn't have any protections against your planned attack, whichever route you choose to go. If those conditions aren't met, I don't see the fighter standing much of a chance at all.

 

[shilsen]

Having characters fight each other is not the way to figure out if they are even in strength.

Best suggestion on the thread. Wizards and fighters (or any pair of classes) in D&D aren't designed to balance out in a one-on-one fight. They are designed to support each other and fill various niches in a group, since D&D is focused on group play. If you want to know if two classes are even in strength, consider what kind of abilities they bring to the group and how much each are required.

 

[RigaMortus2]

Can you use 3.0 stuff as well? Here are a couple suggestions:

Drow + Forsaker PrC class (from Sword and Fist) would have a minimum Spell Resistance of 21, and that is just at character level 3 or so. Drow SR goes up via Character Level, and Forsaker SR goes up via class level. A level 30 Drow Forsaker would have (if I calculate it right) about a 51 SR (Drow base 11 SR + Drow's Character Level 30 + Forsaker Level 10)...

If you can get your hands on anything Anti-Magic, as other have suggested, that would be optimal. Another suggestion is an item with Dimensional Anchor (if you can't get your hands on any Anti-Magic stuff).

A Psychic Warrior could also do some damage here as well, combined with Psionic feats. I may even suggest going an Archer route with the PsyWar... Of course if the Wiz happens to cast Protection from Arrows, you might be screwed...

Even with all this, if the Wizard is prepared, it will still end up winning. A simple Wish spell could take care of the Fighter easily.

 

[Whimsical]

It's still the same issue - making the fighter really good at one or two things.

Not true. A 30th level fighter has 16 fighter feats and 11 or 12 regular feats. He can be excellent at melee, range, grappling, unarmed fighting and be very well rounded in several styles of combat. This is the fighter's advantage over other combat types who focus everything on two-weapon fighting or jump into a prestige class.

 

[M.Weasel]

Hmm...

Take the Mage Slayer feat chain (from Complete Arcane), Combat Reflexes, and fight with a spiked chain. Bump your initiative up as high as possible, since you need to get within reach of the mage before he can cast anything. Get an item of Giant Size (from Complete Arcane) with a 17+ caster level, an item of continuous Antimagic Field created with the Extraordinary Spell Aim metamagic feat (from Complete Adventurer), a Spireshard weapon (weapon enhancement from one of the issues of Dragon, whichever one it was that was devoted to a lot of different campaign settings... It forces the person hit to make a Will save or lose spells/spell-like abilities for 1d4 rounds), a Ring of Counterspelling (I believe that's the name of it... It lets you cast a spell into it that automatically counterspells if you have the same spell cast at you) with Mordenkainen's Disjunction in it, an item of Dimension Door or a similar spell, and anything else that looks good - in particular, stuff with reach is good. Make sure your damage and attack are disgustingly high; you may also want to consider getting a high movement rate and using the Leap Attack and Shock Trooper feats, possibly in conjunction with the Frenzied Berserker PrC (if you can PrC for this challenge), so that you can do a leaping charge as your first attack and deal massive damage. An item from continuous Sadism and Masochism (from the Book of Vile Darkness) may also be worthwhile.

With this setup, you start with a leaping charge (if you can), power attacking for full BAB and transferring all that to AC with Shock Trooper. If you can't charge, you Dimension Door to within 10 ft. of the wizard. With Giant Size and a reach weapon, even without other reach boosters, you should have a reach of 60 ft. Antimagic Field will take care of any spells the wizard casts at you, but Extraordinary Spell Aim will let you be unaffected by it (not cut out of its area of affect, mind - unaffected, meaning spells cast into your square are still disabled). The Ring of Counterspelling will take care of his almost certain casting of Mordenkainen's Disjunction at you, and the Spireshard weapon will hopefully disable him even more. The Mage Slayer feat (and its follow-ups) will keep him from casting anything, with luck, since you get AoOs whenever he casts, your reach is long enough that he can't simply step away (or even use a withdraw action) and cast, and you should be able to do mroe damage than he can make a Concentration check against.

EDIT: Oh, you might also want to invest in the Knock-Down feat from Sword & Fist, if you can. You'll probably have a very high Strength, and you should always deal well over 10 damage, so forcing the wizard to take AoOs from getting up from prone will make him die just a bit faster.